Katherine: Welcome to Transfer Talks Podcast. This is Katherine Lawler, the Transfer Jacks Coordinator at Northern Arizona University and I'll have our guest introduce themselves now.

Kiara: Good morning. Thank you for having me today. My name is Kiara Weathersby. I am Tetna Zuntney from the Navajo Nation, and I am born for the African-American communities from Mississippi and Louisiana, and I am born and raised here in Flagstaff, Arizona. I attended Coconino Community College where I received my Associate's degree, and I also attended Northern Arizona University where I received dual degrees in Business Management as well as Psychological Sciences, and then I attained my Master's degree in Indigenous Education from Arizona State University and the School of Social Transformation. I currently serve as a Manager of Student Development in the Office of Indigenous Student Success, and I am happy to be here today.

Katherine: Wonderful. We're glad to have you too. So let's start off with what was your
experience like at NAU?

Kiara: My experience at NAU was interesting because I was actually part of the pilot program for CCC to NAU, and being part of a pilot program there some clunky situations as the university was working to prepare the university for transfer students like myself, and I was also part of the, what is now the NAU 100 transition to college, and so we actually had to write a 20-page paper and I remember like, I remember feeling just intimidated that my transfer would be unsuccessful because if that was the intro to transition to the university, then how would I be able to be successful in my time. And I remember coming to NAU and trying to find a job. I am a non-traditional student, so in that way, I was doing escrow insurance, escrow and title insurance, which is essentially the people who help homeowners throughout the process when they're first beginning the, the buying process and take care of all of the, the pests inspections and hold the funds for them. And so I was one-day thinking, what do I, what do I want to do with my life? This is not it. I was going to work before the sun rose and I was getting home from work after the sunset, and just kind of living a very lonely kind of like hermit life down in the valley, and that's when I chose to come back to, to the university I mean to community college. And so through that, I was only considered a student and so I couldn't get a full-time position, I had to get student employment, which was very frustrating for me because here I was almost 30 years old, and having to have student employment even though I already had a robust resume. And so I remember, you know, coming here and trying to navigate the university, trying to find my classes, trying to figure out what exactly I wanted to do here, and I was taking a lot of classes. I originally intended to come for Psychology and then, well, I really wanted to do Business I wanted to understand Business, but I had a person who was an advisor and they told me well if you can't do long division in your head then your, Business is not for you. And so kind of changed the trajectory of my thinking about the possibilities of Business as my major. And, and then as I was taking classes in in Psychology in the in the School Social and Behavioral Sciences, I was really enjoying learning about Neuroscience. But then again I, I was told that if, if I didn't have kind of a strong sense of scientific knowledge of the way that drugs interact with people's bodies, that maybe Neuroscience wasn't, or medicine wasn't for me. And so then I was rethinking again and, so then I started to take a couple of other classes and I was really just taking classes all over the place. I was taking way more classes than I needed and I decided to go ahead and pursue a Business degree. And so that extended my time here at the university. And I was taking classes there and getting really involved with student organizations and building kind of my collegiate experience around the Franke College of Business, and had a lot of great mentors there, who were constantly talking about the possibilities and and pushing yourself to learn more and engaging both outside of the classroom as well as inside of the classroom. And, and so that was one of the things that really prompted me to say, you know, I can be a Business major and I will stick with the safe major of Management. And, but it's worked out for me because I feel like Business Management is applicable to life, so it's really helped in that way. But again going back to this idea of taking numerous courses all across campus, not really knowing where I was going, and again because I was part of the pilot program for CCC to NAU, we had a little bit of advising when we first got here, but but it wasn't, it wasn't the kind of advising that students receive nowadays. And so, I, I was I, went to look to see how many credits I needed to graduate, and I was told that actually, I had enough to graduate with two degrees, but I still needed to take three classes. So that's how I ended up having dual degrees, but I also during that time, because I come from a lower socioeconomic background, I was taking out a lot of educational debt. 

Katherine: Right.

Kiara: And because I was take, I was working in these student employee positions that, at that time were six dollars and seventy-five cents an hour, I also was just kind of relying on educational debt, and then I also got another position outside, a seasonal position with Deckers Outdoors, selling Ugg boots and Subo and all kinds of different shoes and Tebas. So that was kind of my experience here at the university, where I was trying to navigate being a student, trying to still have the collegiate experience even though I was nearly ten years senior to, to my class to my cohort and my you know my business fraternity members and, and the Native American Business Organization members. And so it's kind of interesting because I was outside looking in, but also was also part of the experience here at the university. But because of I guess my my transition here and being an a non-traditional student, it was, it was tough for me to try to insert myself into those positions. When I got here to the university, because of my time at the community college, I was invited to come to the International Scholar Laureate Program Global Experience and they had an option which was in China. And I had never been outside of the United States. I don't consider Mexico to be outside just because of the way that those borders were created. And so I never had a passport, and I remember coming here and wanting to participate in this extraordinary offer. And to me at that moment, it seemed like a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity. And so I came and I talked to an elder down at the Applied Indigenous Studies, Marina Vasquez, and she, she was like well let's figure it out. Let's, let's, let's find a way to make this a possibility for you. And so we went to the College of, I mean for the Center for International Education, and we were told that because that specific program was not part of the university, that they didn't think that I should participate. And I was heartbroken and Marina was like well, you know, if that's the case you really want to go then, you know, we will, do you know how to make tamales? and I was like tamales? No. And she's like, you know, because she's Guatemalan, so she's like I will teach you. And so we went to the old farmers market that used to be on 4th Street and we went and got all, you know, the tomatillos and the chilies and the corn husks the masa and everything and she taught me how to make red, red chili, green chili, sweet tamales, and helped me to promote them. And I ended up selling 79 dozen tamales in order to get the funds to pay for a portion of the, of my trip for the International Scholar Laureate program. And I got to go for two weeks to Beijing, Xi'an, Shanghai, and Hong Kong. And that was, I would say, my first memorable experience here at the university. And it would not have happened I don't if, if I hadn't come from the community college because it was through Phi Theta Kappa, the International Honor Society of the two-year college that I had received the information about the ISLP. And then when I was in my Business program for my capstone, there was another opportunity to be part of an international exchange where we went to, to India to Chhattisgarh in Manpat to look at a Tibetan refugee settlement to help them build a business plan. And there it was, it was interesting because I found the people our, our folks that were there with us, they had asked me because I had learned a little bit of Mandarin, I had learned a little bit of the Hindi language. And then and you know when I was younger, because I'm born and raised here in Flagstaff, I went to South Beaver, and they used to bring us over here to NAU and teach me Spanish. And so it was interesting because when I got there and I was talking about you know being a Navajo Citizen in the Navajo Nation, and we were kind of talking about the similarities about clans, about caste systems, about you know, these different ways in which we interact with the world. And that's when they had asked me if I, they were like well, do you speak your own language? And I was taken aback because here I was navigating the world and learning languages in order to you know communicate where I went and be able to greet folks in the, in the ways that their language would help, I guess, kind of build relationships or relationality, and I didn't know my own language. And it was there, through that experience in Manpat, that I was like yeah, I want to learn my language. And so those two experiences really helped me. They solidified my viewpoint of myself as a global citizen and also had me start to think about where my positionality in the world and how I want to show up. And I think if I had not had those experiences, that I don't know if my, my, my career or the way that I've navigated the world would be the same. And when I was, when I went through the university through that exchange program, which is also two weeks, I actually did receive two scholarships through the Center for International Education. The Go Global Opportunity Scholarship and the, there's another scholarship that I received but the name is, is escaping me right now. But those opportunities were afforded by the first trip of making tamales through an elder's advice and guidance. And then the second one through taking out educational debt but also applying for those scholarships here through NAU. And so that's kind of my transfer experience, my, my time here at the university, and what I feel were some challenges but also that helped me to grow, to be able to be the person that I am today and the way that I support students because there were those things that I had to navigate on my own. Would, I think one of the things that I didn't include is that I am also, I was a first-generation student. My mom actually came back to the university and so we had a couple of years together where, where she was finalizing her degree in her Bachelor's degree. So I was a first-generation student but I'm still the first-generation Master's student. And so yeah, that's, that's my experience here at Northern Arizona University. And I think that as far as being a transfer graduate, I, I think that my experience here at the university helped to propel me into going into the School of Social Transformation I, at, at, at Arizona State University because I thought that I wanted to go into law school, and I took some advice and this is why I always, always, always tell people if your advice is not coming from a person in that program who has successfully completed it or who's working to help students get through that program, do not listen. So I took some advice, but I'm accountable for taking that advice, and I didn't do well on the law school admission test, the LSAT. And, but that challenged me to think about okay well what's the next step? How do I navigate this? And so it kind of took me back to where I was that in, when I first started, when I transferred from the community college to the university. Because when I went down to ASU, it essentially was transferring again, right? I had a Bachelor's degree but I was transferring now into a Master's degree kind of mindset. So I had to re-navigate what that looks like, how to be successful, how to write my personal statement to make sure that I had the knowledge, skills, and abilities to get into the program that I wanted to. And so doing that research about the programs that I was looking at. And so what I did is I started taking classes as a non-degree seeking student and really trying to increase my writing skills, my communication and, and started taking a Deneb-Azad or the Navajo language. And that really informed the way that I started to interact at the university down there and I and then I got a management internship position, which helped because it paid for my insurance but also allowed me to be a graduate student, and so just through that in my work with the American Indian Student Support Services and the Office of American Indian Initiatives, that I got to really see myself helping students and giving back in meaningful ways, and answering those questions that they were navigating as well. And that's what brought me full circle to the Indigenous Education Masters, which helped me to learn about a lot of the things that I did not know about our community, the things that were not taught in public schools, or even in my undergraduate classes, unless they were specifically sought out. So as a transfer graduate, it helped me to know that there's different research that I needed to do in order to show up, in order to be successful. And I think that had I not had that experience as a first-gen of learning how to ask questions that I don't know that I would be again that I would be where I'm at now. Part of that also is that, as I shared earlier, I was taking out educational debt, probably the max that you could, along with, you know, being Pell Grant eligible and, and it wasn't until so I already had my Associate's degree and I had been here at the university for two years when I found out about the TRIO Student Support Services Program. And so again that goes back to that kind of that idea of being a transfer if you don't have that guidance of finding out things after the fact. It was also during this time that my father had passed away, and so without TRIO right paying for me to get counseling at, at the counseling services here at the university, teaching me about financial literacy, about credit, about debt, about how to buy a car, how to buy a home. All of these things that you need in the world, but nobody, it's not included in that, in that, in those teachings, unless maybe you have somebody in your family who might have that that financial literacy or that idea of how to navigate the world with, with basic needs. And so through that experience, it really transformed my time. my life because I realized holy crap. I've been taking out a lot of educational debt and how am I gonna ever pay for this? How am I going to pay this back? How am I going to increase my credit score so that I will be able to buy a home, buy a car? You know, and be able to live the life that I thought that, hey if I go to college that I might be able to have access to. And so I'm really thankful for the TRIO Program for opening that door for me, for helping me to understand that it's okay to ask for help, getting me the counseling I needed to navigate grief of a parent. And so that is something about my transfer experience that I really, really appreciate and I think that had it not been for folks like my mentors and TRIO, like the elders here at the university that my, my life would be very different for me, the way that I see it. But that's also why I work so hard to give back to our community because I know what it's like to feel like there's not a way to make it forward and to not know the questions to ask. And I think that's also part of that you know that hidden curriculum of like what questions should you ask? Which offices should you seek out? You know, and it was through those support mechanisms that I was able to do so. And so that's something that I wish people would understand about the transfer experience is because without knowing how to navigate the university, navigating educational debt, finances, budgeting, classes, because I also was a person who I hit the hundred and fifty percent mark. So even though I was receiving scholarships because I had exceeded the amount that the federal government would provide to me, I ended up having to take out a private loan to finish my last semester because I had to do a SAP appeal and a satisfactory academic progress for, I think it was pace of progress, that I needed to do that appeal for. And they said okay you're approved, but you can only move forward if you you can only take the final classes that you need. And my scholarships were like we need you to be full-time. And so I was in this midway location of being so close to attaining my Bachelor's degrees and yet feeling like there was not, like that I wasn't going to be able to complete. And thankfully over in Office of Scholarship and Financial Aid, there were liaisons who helped me. And we made a way, out of no way, which was that private, private loan, but that is what helped me to finish those final three classes so that I could, so that I could graduate with my degree. So my advice to transfer students is to ask, ask questions. Ask the hard questions even if you're like oh that's stupid that I don't, you know. Don't let that internal negative dialogue stop you from asking the question that might help you to get the resources that you need. And be willing to if, if the question doesn't sit right or if you're your intuition is saying hmm I don't know about this, it's okay to ask, ask another person for advice. It's okay to seek out more than one opinion but make sure that when you are making these decisions about your life, that you're really thinking it through, and asking the questions, and doing your research to find out what is going to help you be successful because you're the only person that's accountable for that. And they're, granted I'm not saying that there are people that are doing things maliciously or with malintent, but sometimes people who don't know might give you incorrect information is what I'm saying. And so ask the questions, ask for a second, a second opinion, and do the work, do the readings. I'm telling you, I had such a strong GPA when I first got here and then I met some students again these are people not in my same, they're in my cohort, but they're very different. Age difference and whatnot and they where like yeah I don't read I don't do this. And I was like oh okay I don't have to read all that? I don't have to read the whole text? And I stopped doing that and guess what? My GPA went right along with those readings, So that is something that I also didn't know about was the grade point average and how that can affect your ability to receive scholarships and, and resources. So and once it goes down, it's really hard to get it back up. So that's, that's some advice that I would say if you're a transfer student, is to keep doing the same thing that you were doing when you first started at the community college, put in the work, and you will be you'll be rewarded for that. Yeah, so I think also know and tell yourself that you're gonna make it, you're proud of yourself. I used to put affirmations on sticky notes and put them in my, on my mirror and when I thought that there was no way that I was going to be able to make it through, those affirmations helped me. And it's interesting because now as a professional, I was recently I'm going through and looking through my old papers and trying to kind of get, declutter. And I looked back at those and I was like wow, those really helped me to get here today. And so they become those practices, using your planner, affirmation,s doing the work, getting involved, those are all things that help you as you are navigating your journey but they also help you in your professional life as well.

Katherine: Well, as we conclude, would you like to share any favorite places to eat in Flagstaff?

Kiara: At home. Sorry.

Katherine: All good. Well, I appreciate you being here today. You shared really important aspects of your lived experiences and I think a lot of transfer students are going to appreciate your perspective.

Kiara: Thank you for having me.

Katherine: Of course.