00:00:05:23 - 00:00:07:12 DEKS An Ottawa based artist, 00:00:07:12 - 00:00:10:12 graph and mural artist with over 20 years in the game. 00:00:10:14 - 00:00:11:23 Supposedly. That's cool. 00:00:11:23 - 00:00:14:23 His work, blends hip hop influences, 00:00:16:09 - 00:00:19:09 big folk. 00:00:23:18 - 00:00:24:09 Hey, everyone. 00:00:24:09 - 00:00:27:14 Welcome to Did You Know on Urban Creatives where we dive 00:00:27:14 - 00:00:30:19 into the story, struggles and successes of artist shaping our urban landscape. 00:00:31:03 - 00:00:34:08 I'm your host, Jason Machinski, alongside my co-host Lindsay Machinski. 00:00:34:08 - 00:00:38:00 This season, we're bringing you The Roundtable Sessions, a special series 00:00:38:00 - 00:00:41:02 where artists transform upcycle tables into works of art. 00:00:41:17 - 00:00:45:10 Sparking conversation about creativity, culture, and the community they come from. 00:00:45:10 - 00:00:49:14 And today we're talking with Phil or better known as DEKS. 00:00:49:16 - 00:00:52:18 And it's an Ottawa based artist, graph 00:00:52:19 - 00:00:55:22 and mural artist with over 20 years in the game, supposedly. 00:00:55:22 - 00:00:56:21 That's cool. 00:00:56:21 - 00:00:59:13 His work blends hip hop influences, 00:01:01:03 - 00:01:03:06 folk and esthetics. 00:01:03:06 - 00:01:05:21 You don't seem that old ducks. That's why. And skate culture. 00:01:05:21 - 00:01:08:21 All while pushing the boundaries of graffiti. Art. 00:01:09:00 - 00:01:12:15 He's also an educator and a key player in Ottawa's urban art scene. 00:01:12:18 - 00:01:15:20 We'll be chatting about his process, the piece, he created 00:01:15:20 - 00:01:18:14 for the roundtable sessions, which is just over here behind him, 00:01:18:14 - 00:01:21:21 and the connections between skateboarding murals and digital art. 00:01:22:02 - 00:01:24:17 So let's get into it, supposedly. 00:01:24:17 - 00:01:26:08 Yeah, I like that. 00:01:26:08 - 00:01:28:12 So we've heard. 00:01:28:12 - 00:01:31:13 So, your graffiti, your work incorporates 00:01:31:13 - 00:01:34:22 a mix of influences from hip hop to comic books and street culture. 00:01:34:22 - 00:01:38:01 What were some of the biggest artistic influences that shaped your style? 00:01:38:01 - 00:01:40:05 You really just jumped right into that. Was they not supposed to? 00:01:40:05 - 00:01:42:01 Oh no, no, no, it's a great question. 00:01:42:01 - 00:01:45:13 It's a great question for yeah. 00:01:45:13 - 00:01:49:20 Like I actually got into skateboarding before I got into graffiti. 00:01:50:05 - 00:01:54:21 And so skateboarding really had a huge impact on my life when I was growing up. 00:01:54:21 - 00:01:57:22 I got into it in, like early adolescent 00:01:57:22 - 00:02:00:23 stages and, it was 00:02:02:05 - 00:02:04:05 influential in so many different ways. 00:02:04:05 - 00:02:10:04 Like, it opened me up to art that I would have never discovered on my own. 00:02:10:04 - 00:02:14:16 I mean, you know, I can speak to watching skate videos and being influenced 00:02:14:16 - 00:02:19:01 by the song choices that, skaters would include for their parts. 00:02:19:01 - 00:02:20:12 And that was kind of eye opening. 00:02:20:12 - 00:02:24:06 But, graffiti was always around the skate parks. 00:02:24:06 - 00:02:25:21 And so that was always something that drew me 00:02:25:21 - 00:02:29:12 to like the visual aspects of, like the physical environment. 00:02:29:12 - 00:02:32:15 I was just like blown away by all the different colors 00:02:32:15 - 00:02:35:21 and all the different styles and just how well it meshed 00:02:35:21 - 00:02:38:16 with, skateboarding culture and like, the atmosphere. 00:02:38:16 - 00:02:40:15 So that was definitely a big influence. 00:02:40:15 - 00:02:45:02 But skateboard graphics too, was something that I was always really 00:02:45:02 - 00:02:45:21 drawn to. 00:02:45:21 - 00:02:50:18 You know, I think of like early World Industries graphics, 00:02:50:18 - 00:02:53:21 that were just kind of pushing the boundaries in terms of, 00:02:53:21 - 00:02:56:05 like the content, like some of it was just like, 00:02:57:14 - 00:02:59:02 I don't know, for lack of a 00:02:59:02 - 00:03:02:23 better term, vulgar, but like, in your face. 00:03:02:23 - 00:03:07:22 And it was always just this kind of, like, cartoony, graffiti esque kind of style. 00:03:07:22 - 00:03:11:10 So I'd say skateboard graphics and just the graffiti 00:03:11:10 - 00:03:15:03 that I saw around skate parks was definitely a huge influence for me. 00:03:15:03 - 00:03:19:03 Like when I started seeing that, I was like, oh, I want to try doing that myself. 00:03:19:09 - 00:03:20:06 That's really cool. 00:03:20:06 - 00:03:22:00 Yeah, and you're right, they're very interconnected. 00:03:22:00 - 00:03:24:11 I think there's other questions that we have specifically around that too. 00:03:24:11 - 00:03:25:08 Yeah. Okay. 00:03:25:08 - 00:03:29:02 So graffiti can be both personal and public at the same time. 00:03:29:11 - 00:03:32:07 So how do you balance being true to your lived experience, 00:03:32:07 - 00:03:34:20 but also creating something that connects with the community? 00:03:34:20 - 00:03:37:07 Or do you just not really give a shit about that? 00:03:37:07 - 00:03:42:05 No, I do, I do, supposedly I do, supposedly I do. 00:03:43:18 - 00:03:45:17 I know it's a great question. 00:03:45:17 - 00:03:50:07 You know, like I think that, a lot of it is kind of personal because it's me 00:03:50:07 - 00:03:55:21 sort of putting, my whatever's going on in my head, out into the world. 00:03:55:21 - 00:03:58:14 But, it's always this interesting thing. 00:03:58:14 - 00:04:01:18 My mentor growing up always kind of taught me a few things 00:04:01:18 - 00:04:06:06 about the world of graffiti and, and, you know, different outlooks on it. 00:04:06:06 - 00:04:07:20 And he always said, like, 00:04:07:20 - 00:04:11:05 as soon as you're done with the piece, you're painting it out on a wall for, 00:04:11:05 - 00:04:14:16 for the public to see then, you know, you're, you're 00:04:15:17 - 00:04:16:20 it's not yours anymore. 00:04:16:20 - 00:04:19:05 Like, once you're done with the piece and it's on the wall, 00:04:19:05 - 00:04:21:15 it's for the public and it's for everybody else to enjoy. 00:04:21:15 - 00:04:25:21 So you kind of have to just take a step back and not really take ownership of it. 00:04:25:21 - 00:04:28:23 And I really thought that that was a beautiful thing, because while 00:04:28:23 - 00:04:31:23 I'm doing it, I have this really deep personal connection to it. 00:04:31:23 - 00:04:36:13 And even if I see it, afterwards, like once it's done, you know, 00:04:36:16 - 00:04:40:09 I still have this sort of genuine, connection to it. 00:04:40:09 - 00:04:44:11 But at a certain point, you just kind of throw it out there, 00:04:44:11 - 00:04:48:02 and once it's out there, it's just for the public to enjoy, 00:04:48:14 - 00:04:51:00 and they can kind of interpret it however they want. 00:04:51:00 - 00:04:54:00 So I've never been like a big like, 00:04:54:02 - 00:04:57:01 I don't know, protector of my art or anything like that. 00:04:57:01 - 00:04:59:21 I just if it gets barfed, it gets buffed. 00:04:59:21 - 00:05:02:20 If somebody goes over it, somebody goes over it 00:05:02:20 - 00:05:05:20 and you know, it's it's just part of the whole process. 00:05:06:04 - 00:05:07:04 Who's your mentor, by the way? 00:05:08:08 - 00:05:09:06 I had two 00:05:09:06 - 00:05:13:08 I, when I got into graffiti, there was, a local artist 00:05:14:03 - 00:05:17:05 shoutouts to again, one 00:05:17:05 - 00:05:20:05 he is, a fantastic graffiti artist. 00:05:20:08 - 00:05:22:03 He's still somewhat active. 00:05:22:03 - 00:05:26:02 But, back in the day, he used to write bizarre and, 00:05:26:02 - 00:05:29:15 he used to just hang around the skate park, and I used to see him a lot. 00:05:29:19 - 00:05:32:19 He was actually younger than me by, like, four years, 00:05:33:03 - 00:05:36:00 but he was just this, like, young protege that was growing up 00:05:36:00 - 00:05:40:02 and just kind of really, like, got a lot of, like, the stuff 00:05:40:02 - 00:05:43:07 you need to be a good graffiti artist very early. 00:05:43:18 - 00:05:47:10 And, he was just, like, completely enthralled by the world. 00:05:47:10 - 00:05:52:06 So I was just pumped on his enthusiasm and his passion for graffiti. 00:05:52:06 - 00:05:54:16 So I just started following around him, around. 00:05:54:16 - 00:05:55:16 We started hanging out. 00:05:55:16 - 00:05:58:17 We started going out at night and just you know, doing our thing. 00:05:58:17 - 00:06:03:08 And, he was just a big inspiration for me in terms of just 00:06:04:12 - 00:06:05:07 the, the 00:06:05:07 - 00:06:10:08 knowledge that I gained from like, technical abilities to just like this 00:06:11:01 - 00:06:14:21 raw love for going out and painting. 00:06:14:21 - 00:06:17:05 So, he was a big inspiration. 00:06:17:05 - 00:06:18:20 I learned a lot from him. 00:06:18:20 - 00:06:21:10 And then my second mentor 00:06:21:10 - 00:06:24:02 was a dude who wrote, Sex Sack. 00:06:24:02 - 00:06:28:07 And he used to run with this crew called the BRC. 00:06:28:08 - 00:06:29:10 I might be mistaken. Not. 00:06:29:10 - 00:06:33:04 But forgive me if I if I get those details wrong, but, 00:06:33:04 - 00:06:37:07 he was someone that, we met through mutual friends. 00:06:37:16 - 00:06:41:13 And when I discovered that he was, this writer that I was looking up to, 00:06:41:16 - 00:06:45:02 it just I was, like, starstruck, basically. 00:06:45:11 - 00:06:49:06 And he was nice enough to take me out, even though I was 00:06:49:06 - 00:06:52:23 still fairly new to the game, and I just was not at his level at all. 00:06:53:10 - 00:06:56:09 But he still took me out and he showed me a few things. 00:06:56:09 - 00:07:00:22 And like I said earlier, like I he imparted a lot of wisdom 00:07:00:22 - 00:07:05:17 in terms of like outlook on graffiti and how it differs from other art forms. 00:07:05:17 - 00:07:09:13 And I just really liked the thoughtfulness that he put into it, 00:07:09:13 - 00:07:13:04 how we could have these like, deep conversations about art 00:07:13:04 - 00:07:17:16 and sometimes have no depth to our conversations at all, you know? 00:07:17:16 - 00:07:20:15 And he just made it seem really fun. 00:07:20:18 - 00:07:24:04 But he also made it seem like it was something worth doing. 00:07:24:04 - 00:07:25:11 You know? 00:07:25:11 - 00:07:28:22 So mentorship was a big thing that early on for you, for sure. 00:07:28:22 - 00:07:32:17 I feel like I don't know if it really exists anymore, 00:07:32:17 - 00:07:36:08 but I think back in the day, like in the old school days of of graffiti. 00:07:37:12 - 00:07:37:18 Yeah. 00:07:37:18 - 00:07:39:17 I'm not talking like that old school right now. 00:07:39:17 - 00:07:42:11 I've only been in the game supposedly for 20 years. 00:07:42:11 - 00:07:46:20 But, you know, it was it was kind of, 00:07:48:02 - 00:07:50:19 there was this idea of, like, if you want to get into it 00:07:50:19 - 00:07:54:01 and you kind of have to be, like, brought into it 00:07:54:01 - 00:07:55:22 by someone who's been around for a while, 00:07:55:22 - 00:07:58:22 who has gained a little bit of respect in the world of graffiti. 00:07:59:04 - 00:08:03:10 And, you know, this was this was just part of the process, 00:08:03:10 - 00:08:05:01 like those first few times 00:08:05:01 - 00:08:07:08 you're going out and you're trying to figure it out on your own. 00:08:07:08 - 00:08:10:04 But if you're lucky enough to find someone who's been doing it long enough, 00:08:10:04 - 00:08:11:06 they can give you like, 00:08:11:06 - 00:08:15:05 shortcuts in terms of your development because they they teach you things. 00:08:15:05 - 00:08:18:20 And, I, I found it really beneficial to me 00:08:19:04 - 00:08:23:19 just having a community or even just a few people to hang around 00:08:24:06 - 00:08:28:23 to, you know, help me progress as an artist and. 00:08:29:02 - 00:08:33:03 Yeah, I it was just something that I always appreciated from the get go. 00:08:33:19 - 00:08:35:06 I think in that way, too. 00:08:35:06 - 00:08:38:12 Anybody like if you hear mentorship in the city still in the graph scene, 00:08:38:22 - 00:08:41:03 I think mimic was probably somebody that, 00:08:41:03 - 00:08:42:18 you know, a lot of people really looked up to 00:08:42:18 - 00:08:46:02 and like, he had a lot of younger people that like he helped along the way 00:08:46:02 - 00:08:48:18 and stuff like that. So for sure, yeah, for sure. 00:08:48:18 - 00:08:53:14 There was always like, it back, you know, in the early 2000, 00:08:53:16 - 00:08:56:18 it was still kind of like a small world, you know, everyone 00:08:56:18 - 00:09:01:07 kind of like knew each other through whether it's like internet forums 00:09:01:07 - 00:09:05:15 or just like meeting up at spots and, and there being a bunch of writers there. 00:09:06:00 - 00:09:08:04 But you always heard about different writers, 00:09:08:04 - 00:09:10:08 and it wasn't just their art style that you would talk about. 00:09:10:08 - 00:09:14:23 It would like their outlook on graffiti or like what they've done 00:09:14:23 - 00:09:16:09 for other people growing up. 00:09:16:09 - 00:09:20:08 Like, it all sort of mattered, and it was all part of the. 00:09:20:20 - 00:09:22:17 Yeah, yeah. 00:09:22:17 - 00:09:25:17 So I think we're swinging back to the roundtable then, I guess. 00:09:25:23 - 00:09:28:16 So I got I have another question for you about the round table. 00:09:28:16 - 00:09:29:23 The piece behind you, 00:09:29:23 - 00:09:33:06 the round table sessions, you painted a piece on a round wooden table, 00:09:33:06 - 00:09:35:01 something very different from a wall or canvas. 00:09:35:01 - 00:09:37:07 I know you've mentioned that when you were painting, too, 00:09:37:07 - 00:09:38:13 what was your experience like? 00:09:38:13 - 00:09:40:13 And did the chat, the shape, challenge 00:09:40:13 - 00:09:44:00 you in the piece itself or just simply just painting on a table? 00:09:44:16 - 00:09:47:23 I mean, it's it's something that I, I don't really do very often. 00:09:48:00 - 00:09:51:09 Most of the time when I'm painting, I'm painting a wall 00:09:51:09 - 00:09:54:15 or I'm painting a very large canvas or surface. 00:09:55:17 - 00:09:57:05 So, you know, 00:09:57:05 - 00:10:00:16 even though this is a pretty large canvas, I was kind of like, nervous 00:10:00:16 - 00:10:04:13 going into it because I just don't really paint at this scale. 00:10:05:00 - 00:10:07:02 But, the shape didn't bother me. 00:10:07:02 - 00:10:10:08 I thought the shape was actually wicked, and the and the texture and the whole idea 00:10:10:08 - 00:10:14:01 of you guys using these vintage tables, it was just awesome. 00:10:14:01 - 00:10:18:00 So the challenge was just coming up with something that was like small enough 00:10:18:00 - 00:10:22:13 that that could be readable and, and that I could incorporate into this. 00:10:22:13 - 00:10:26:01 So, I went with, sort of a stencil street 00:10:26:01 - 00:10:29:22 art approach and, you know, just spray painted the whole thing. 00:10:29:22 - 00:10:31:00 And it was really cool. 00:10:31:00 - 00:10:34:09 I just added a bunch of layers to it and just layer after layer. 00:10:34:14 - 00:10:35:22 Harder to make it much. 00:10:35:22 - 00:10:37:17 Yeah. Just wait till the timelapse comes out. 00:10:37:17 - 00:10:39:11 Yeah. No, but it was it was cool. 00:10:39:11 - 00:10:42:23 You know, like, I, I took it on as a challenge. 00:10:42:23 - 00:10:45:18 I think, I'm stoked on the final product. It looks amazing. 00:10:45:18 - 00:10:50:06 And, it still kind of stays true to what I would do on a wall. 00:10:50:06 - 00:10:54:02 So I think, like, it's it's still kind of matches my general style. 00:10:54:07 - 00:10:55:11 It's funny that most people. 00:10:55:11 - 00:10:58:08 Sorry, the paint on walls, they're like, I can't paint small mixes. 00:10:58:08 - 00:11:00:17 Said that over and over and over again. And you were saying that too. 00:11:00:17 - 00:11:03:17 So it's it's it's interesting because like, you guys want to do big. 00:11:03:20 - 00:11:06:13 There's a wall behind me that has been seen, by the way. 00:11:06:13 - 00:11:09:13 So yeah, it's pretty it's pretty rad. 00:11:09:23 - 00:11:12:09 It's just the freedom, you know, when you have so much space, 00:11:12:09 - 00:11:15:12 like you can just play around with it and you don't have to really worry about, 00:11:15:12 - 00:11:17:14 like, is it going to fit is not right. 00:11:17:14 - 00:11:18:18 Does that much space freak you out? 00:11:18:18 - 00:11:19:10 There's some sometimes. 00:11:19:10 - 00:11:22:08 Or you're like, oh shit, I got to fill that sometimes. 00:11:22:08 - 00:11:24:08 Yeah, sometimes when you put your first outline 00:11:24:08 - 00:11:27:21 on, you're like, oh, this, this isn't going the way that I wanted to. 00:11:27:21 - 00:11:28:11 But the great thing 00:11:28:11 - 00:11:32:15 about having all that extra space is if you have extra room to fill, just 00:11:32:23 - 00:11:35:03 you fill it with whatever you've got, you know, it's 00:11:35:03 - 00:11:39:16 it's always just kind of like a, natural approach, like the, the piece 00:11:39:16 - 00:11:42:23 you did behind the community wall I disrupt was very long. 00:11:43:00 - 00:11:43:20 Yeah, right. 00:11:43:20 - 00:11:47:00 We were able to fill stuff in between it after and stuff like that too. 00:11:47:00 - 00:11:47:18 Yeah, exactly. 00:11:47:18 - 00:11:50:17 It's really cool. Like the bigger the better I. Yeah. 00:11:50:17 - 00:11:51:13 If you can give me like, 00:11:51:13 - 00:11:55:07 a good space, like I'll fill it and, it might not be filled. 00:11:55:07 - 00:11:56:15 We'll fill it. People. 00:11:56:15 - 00:11:58:01 Yeah. That's. 00:11:58:01 - 00:11:58:08 Yeah. 00:11:58:08 - 00:12:01:08 That's right I love the I love the texture, 00:12:01:09 - 00:12:02:18 the texture of the tables too, 00:12:02:18 - 00:12:05:01 which we were nervous about because they were pretty beat up. 00:12:05:01 - 00:12:05:08 Yeah. 00:12:05:08 - 00:12:07:07 But it does kind of mimic a wall a little bit 00:12:07:07 - 00:12:09:09 with the texture of a wall, which is really cool. Yeah. 00:12:09:09 - 00:12:11:02 Because like the wolf's eyes and stuff like that, 00:12:11:02 - 00:12:13:07 you see the texture and the sheep and everything else like that too. 00:12:13:07 - 00:12:15:02 It's pretty sick. Well, yeah. 00:12:15:02 - 00:12:15:18 And you see that, 00:12:15:18 - 00:12:17:13 like you said, with walls, like where there's a lot of, like, 00:12:17:13 - 00:12:19:15 broken bricks and different things that are happening 00:12:19:15 - 00:12:21:22 where they're not clean, perfect, smooth surfaces. 00:12:21:22 - 00:12:25:01 And it does add that kind of extra street feel to it, which I love. 00:12:25:01 - 00:12:25:13 Yeah. 00:12:25:13 - 00:12:29:01 But the, the, the texture adds to like the storytelling element. 00:12:29:02 - 00:12:29:18 Yeah. All right. 00:12:29:18 - 00:12:33:23 Because like, you know, you're, you're looking at this in every little scratch. 00:12:33:23 - 00:12:36:07 And the table has its own sort of story behind it. 00:12:36:07 - 00:12:37:17 So I, I love it. 00:12:37:17 - 00:12:41:01 As soon as I started putting like black paint around, like on the, 00:12:41:08 - 00:12:44:15 the table, the some of those scratches and blemishes 00:12:44:15 - 00:12:46:09 and whatnot started to come through there. 00:12:46:09 - 00:12:49:09 When I up that yeah, it was super cool. 00:12:49:17 - 00:12:49:23 Yeah. 00:12:49:23 - 00:12:52:05 Like even the one in front of us has so much. 00:12:52:05 - 00:12:54:04 That's cool. Yeah, that's really cool. 00:12:54:04 - 00:12:58:01 Walk us through the artwork you created and what was the inspiration behind it, 00:12:58:01 - 00:12:59:20 and how does it tie in to your usual themes? 00:12:59:20 - 00:13:01:13 So yeah, I think you kind of touched on some of that. 00:13:01:13 - 00:13:02:23 But yeah. 00:13:02:23 - 00:13:07:12 So like the the idea is like oftentimes when I'm looking for like inspiration 00:13:07:12 - 00:13:10:15 for something, whether it's like a lettering design or a character design, 00:13:11:03 - 00:13:15:01 I'm always like thinking about like phrases that have really like, stuck with me. 00:13:16:00 - 00:13:16:06 I'm an 00:13:16:06 - 00:13:19:18 English teacher, so I like looking at some of these, like, 00:13:20:09 - 00:13:24:13 statements that have been made and the deeper meaning behind them. 00:13:24:13 - 00:13:29:20 So one statement that has always kind of stuck with me was this, Latin phrase 00:13:30:04 - 00:13:33:20 homo hominy lupus, which is man is wolf to man. 00:13:34:10 - 00:13:40:09 And, I kind of tied it with this idea of like a wolf in sheep's clothing, 00:13:40:09 - 00:13:44:10 kind of like, deception and all that other stuff. 00:13:44:10 - 00:13:48:05 So it's kind of a reminder for us to, maybe 00:13:49:01 - 00:13:53:16 not give our trust away so easily and, but with, like, 00:13:53:16 - 00:13:56:23 the style, like, I wanted it to be playful, like anything that I do. 00:13:57:08 - 00:14:00:06 I'm never really going about it in, like, a serious way. 00:14:00:06 - 00:14:03:09 You know, you know, we talked about this earlier, but, 00:14:03:20 - 00:14:07:04 part of the reason why I'm still doing graffiti and why 00:14:07:04 - 00:14:11:11 I make art like this is because it's a connection to my inner child. 00:14:11:11 - 00:14:14:06 I, I have fun when I do this, 00:14:14:06 - 00:14:17:18 and I hope that when people look at my artwork, they at least smile 00:14:17:18 - 00:14:20:15 or they have a little bit of fun engaging with it, you know? 00:14:20:15 - 00:14:23:15 So, I just wanted to take this, like, 00:14:24:00 - 00:14:27:06 wolf in sheep's clothing idea, but just make it really fun. 00:14:27:06 - 00:14:28:19 And it is really fun. 00:14:28:19 - 00:14:30:23 That's that's that's my whole approach, you know? 00:14:30:23 - 00:14:32:12 I want it to be colorful. 00:14:32:12 - 00:14:34:01 I want it to be bold. 00:14:34:01 - 00:14:37:02 And I just want to make sure that, it 00:14:38:06 - 00:14:38:19 has that 00:14:38:19 - 00:14:41:21 sort of outlook that I have towards art. 00:14:41:21 - 00:14:44:21 And, a reminder for people to just kind of, 00:14:45:23 - 00:14:48:05 smile and maybe not take things so seriously. 00:14:48:05 - 00:14:51:13 Yeah, yeah, it's a good thing for these sort of times, that's for sure. 00:14:51:13 - 00:14:54:13 Especially. Yeah. To fuck. 00:14:54:23 - 00:14:55:08 Yeah. 00:14:55:08 - 00:14:57:06 I'm sure I'm swearing there. 00:14:57:06 - 00:14:59:00 So you're a skateboarder? 00:14:59:00 - 00:14:59:15 Yeah. Yeah. 00:14:59:15 - 00:15:03:03 And your brother co-owns, Berlin skate shop. Yes. 00:15:03:03 - 00:15:04:15 He does. Yeah. Shout out to Berlin. 00:15:04:15 - 00:15:05:13 Yeah, yeah. 00:15:05:13 - 00:15:08:02 Skate culture and graffiti have always been connected. 00:15:08:02 - 00:15:09:23 Do you see that influence in your own work? 00:15:09:23 - 00:15:11:20 If we really answer that question? Sort of. 00:15:11:20 - 00:15:14:08 He started with, I think, but I think I feel like there's more to it. 00:15:14:08 - 00:15:14:17 Yeah. 00:15:14:17 - 00:15:16:15 Oh, I could definitely, like, expand. 00:15:16:15 - 00:15:18:02 I mean, I think that there 00:15:19:09 - 00:15:22:03 there are lots of similarities between the two. 00:15:22:03 - 00:15:25:03 They're both like urban forms of expression. 00:15:25:08 - 00:15:25:18 Yeah. 00:15:25:18 - 00:15:28:16 We're using like the city landscape 00:15:28:16 - 00:15:33:01 and the physical environment of the city as our, our canvas. 00:15:33:01 - 00:15:36:19 I mean, I look at skateboarding as an art form more than anything else. 00:15:37:10 - 00:15:42:02 And, for skateboarders to go out and find 00:15:42:20 - 00:15:47:02 ledges, benches, any kind of like physical object 00:15:47:08 - 00:15:50:13 located within the city and just kind of use it for something 00:15:50:13 - 00:15:54:07 that it wasn't intentionally used for takes a lot of creativity, you know? 00:15:54:07 - 00:15:56:02 And it's it's really cool. 00:15:56:02 - 00:16:00:03 It's it's got the same raw feel as graffiti, because in graffiti 00:16:00:03 - 00:16:03:03 where we're looking around for canvases, 00:16:03:06 - 00:16:06:06 on walls and for different, spaces. 00:16:06:17 - 00:16:12:15 So I think that, there's definitely a lot of similarities between the two. 00:16:12:15 - 00:16:16:09 The worlds have definitely collided in very real ways. 00:16:16:09 - 00:16:20:04 I mean, when you go to any skate park, you'll always see, graffiti there. 00:16:20:21 - 00:16:23:12 You'll see graffiti on skateboard graphics. 00:16:23:12 - 00:16:27:00 It seems like the to kind of emerged around 00:16:27:00 - 00:16:30:06 the same time and were kind of growing, like symbiotically. 00:16:30:06 - 00:16:30:19 Yeah. 00:16:30:19 - 00:16:33:19 But at the same time, it's funny that you mention it like, 00:16:33:21 - 00:16:37:09 if you ask, like, hardcore skaters, how they feel about graffiti, 00:16:37:18 - 00:16:40:21 they don't necessarily see it, in a positive light. 00:16:40:21 - 00:16:44:01 I always found that very shocking, by the way, when I, when we first started 00:16:44:01 - 00:16:47:00 to kind of explore street art more and graffiti, 00:16:47:01 - 00:16:49:18 we always saw the two kind of went hand in hand. 00:16:49:18 - 00:16:51:23 And like you explained, they really kind of do. 00:16:51:23 - 00:16:56:00 But the culture is definitely don't always overlap like yours does. 00:16:56:00 - 00:16:59:10 And there's definitely, definitely the skate, skateboarders or graph artists, 00:16:59:22 - 00:17:03:07 but it doesn't always overlap like you'd think it would. 00:17:03:21 - 00:17:05:10 I mean, I think that it's really silly 00:17:05:10 - 00:17:07:15 because, like, there's a lot more similarities. 00:17:07:15 - 00:17:09:17 There are differences between the two worlds, 00:17:09:17 - 00:17:11:19 you know, and I think if people were to just step back 00:17:11:19 - 00:17:14:21 and look at the big picture, then see that like it's obviously like 00:17:15:12 - 00:17:20:22 two peas in a pod situation, you know, but like, there's there's valid reasons 00:17:20:22 - 00:17:25:01 why, let's say like skaters might not appreciate graffiti and like it. 00:17:25:01 - 00:17:26:08 It's really as simple 00:17:26:08 - 00:17:30:01 as sometimes, skaters don't like graffiti in their skate parks. 00:17:30:03 - 00:17:30:12 Okay. 00:17:30:12 - 00:17:31:19 If you're painting a surface 00:17:31:19 - 00:17:34:01 and then I'm going to skate on it, it's going to make it slippery. 00:17:34:01 - 00:17:36:11 Yeah. Sometimes it makes you think. 00:17:36:11 - 00:17:39:13 Okay, some skaters just really like clean parks, 00:17:39:13 - 00:17:42:13 whereas graffiti artists see it as, like, just another canvas. 00:17:42:15 - 00:17:43:09 Right. 00:17:43:09 - 00:17:46:22 So I think that there's just kind of like a misunderstanding when it comes to that. 00:17:47:03 - 00:17:47:12 Yeah. 00:17:47:12 - 00:17:50:21 And then similarly, like graffiti artists might 00:17:51:20 - 00:17:53:22 hold ill will to skaters for maybe 00:17:53:22 - 00:17:58:05 messing up their, their pieces like skating street spots and whatnot. 00:17:58:05 - 00:17:59:01 Right. Yeah. 00:17:59:01 - 00:18:04:00 But I mean, realistically, I think that most graffiti artists 00:18:04:00 - 00:18:04:15 I've met 00:18:04:15 - 00:18:08:00 have dabbled in skateboarding or have connections to the skateboarding world, 00:18:08:10 - 00:18:11:03 and a lot of skaters that I know have dabbled in graffiti 00:18:11:03 - 00:18:13:18 and just know a lot of graffiti artists. See, that makes sense. 00:18:13:18 - 00:18:15:05 You know, I think like the it's, it's 00:18:15:05 - 00:18:18:06 a like mindedness that that really sort of connects us all together. 00:18:18:06 - 00:18:21:00 But it's just funny how some people see it very differently. 00:18:21:00 - 00:18:22:13 Yeah. Yeah. 00:18:22:13 - 00:18:25:20 I think my question kind of, talks about that a bit more, but I'll read it 00:18:25:20 - 00:18:27:18 anyways just to make sure we covered it. 00:18:27:18 - 00:18:30:17 So skateboarding and graffiti have always shared a deep connection. 00:18:30:17 - 00:18:33:14 Both, take inspiration from the urban landscape, 00:18:33:14 - 00:18:36:16 transforming everyday spaces into something dynamic and expressive. 00:18:37:02 - 00:18:40:01 As a skateboarder and graffiti artist, do you see a direct link 00:18:40:01 - 00:18:40:23 between the two cultures? 00:18:40:23 - 00:18:43:15 Yes. Have they? How have they influenced 00:18:43:15 - 00:18:46:15 your creative process and the way you approach your work? 00:18:46:23 - 00:18:48:02 I guess coming from both. 00:18:48:02 - 00:18:50:07 Yeah, yeah. I mean, 00:18:51:07 - 00:18:52:21 it's funny 00:18:52:21 - 00:18:55:04 how graffiti gets 00:18:55:04 - 00:18:58:04 you to sort of look at the city a little bit differently. 00:18:58:22 - 00:19:01:22 Similarly, with skateboarding, I mean, like we were talking about, 00:19:02:01 - 00:19:05:21 you know, earlier today how sometimes I'll be, like, walking down the street 00:19:05:21 - 00:19:10:01 with my wife and I will just, like, stop and stare at this 00:19:10:01 - 00:19:14:11 like one little chunk of concrete that is so insignificant to most people. 00:19:14:11 - 00:19:16:20 And like, no one would even really stop and think about it. 00:19:16:20 - 00:19:21:19 But I'm sitting there just like worshiping this thing, just like, this is amazing. 00:19:21:19 - 00:19:24:19 Like I'm I'm taking photos of it and I'm like, 00:19:24:19 - 00:19:28:13 sending photos to my brother, like, you know, like, this is the sick spot. 00:19:28:20 - 00:19:31:17 And and graffiti works the same way. 00:19:31:17 - 00:19:33:14 Like, sometimes I'll see some, like, dirty alley 00:19:33:14 - 00:19:35:10 that, like, everybody just walks by all the time. 00:19:35:10 - 00:19:35:21 And I'm like, 00:19:35:21 - 00:19:39:07 I look at this brick wall, I'm like, wow, this is just a beautiful canvas. 00:19:39:07 - 00:19:42:00 Like, something should go here, you know? 00:19:42:00 - 00:19:45:14 So, you know, I think like the to kind of 00:19:45:14 - 00:19:48:15 get you to see urban spaces a little bit differently. 00:19:48:15 - 00:19:51:07 Yeah. And, they feed off of each other. 00:19:51:07 - 00:19:53:14 So now that, like when I go travel, when I go to a new city 00:19:53:14 - 00:19:55:20 that I've never been before, I'm looking at it 00:19:55:20 - 00:19:59:16 basically through the eyes of both a skater and a graffiti artist. 00:19:59:16 - 00:20:02:07 And those are the things that I'm looking for most. 00:20:02:07 - 00:20:06:08 It's funny because you see so much more than most people would see, right? 00:20:06:08 - 00:20:08:04 And even as a photographer, when I used to like 00:20:08:04 - 00:20:10:20 I was telling you about this, I used to stare in like a weird, 00:20:10:20 - 00:20:14:01 like rusty, like old disgusting walls because I'm like, oh, that's really cool. 00:20:14:01 - 00:20:17:10 I could use this for something and just re-envision their spaces differently. 00:20:17:10 - 00:20:18:06 And I think, 00:20:18:06 - 00:20:21:22 even looking at vacant spaces and disrupt this year is going to kind of focus 00:20:21:22 - 00:20:23:12 on vacant spaces, 00:20:23:12 - 00:20:24:21 because there's so much in our city 00:20:24:21 - 00:20:26:15 that we just kind of like walk by and we're like, 00:20:26:15 - 00:20:28:23 oh, it's just like an old rundown building and stuff like that. 00:20:28:23 - 00:20:30:04 Same with our Art hub. 00:20:30:04 - 00:20:33:00 Like it was pretty sad looking when we had it. 00:20:33:00 - 00:20:33:09 So it's 00:20:33:09 - 00:20:36:09 it's about looking at our city differently and being like, what can we put there? 00:20:36:09 - 00:20:38:00 How can we use it in a different way? 00:20:38:00 - 00:20:41:09 And I think the the collaboration that the NCC did with 00:20:41:09 - 00:20:43:21 your brother was kind of on it speaks to that. Right? 00:20:43:21 - 00:20:46:17 Because you're looking at a space that most people are like, 00:20:46:17 - 00:20:49:00 well, this is for this and this is the NCC, 00:20:49:00 - 00:20:52:01 and it's supposed to be like benches and stuff, but skateboarders 00:20:52:07 - 00:20:55:06 see it as something that they could use to like skate on. 00:20:55:06 - 00:20:55:11 Right. 00:20:55:11 - 00:20:58:01 And it's bridge bridging those gaps of saying like, 00:20:58:01 - 00:20:59:17 it doesn't have to be one way or the other. 00:20:59:17 - 00:21:01:08 We can work together as a community to 00:21:01:08 - 00:21:03:04 everybody gets to use a space in a different way. 00:21:03:04 - 00:21:06:23 And I think that speaking on graffiti, like if you even look at Christopher 00:21:06:23 - 00:21:09:04 Griffin versus mimic under the bridge over there, 00:21:09:04 - 00:21:11:16 there's that whole everyone's like, oh, Christopher Griffin, 00:21:11:16 - 00:21:14:18 everything you do is amazing because you're covering up mimics work, 00:21:15:04 - 00:21:18:17 but they're looking at it from the lies of that's the work that they like. 00:21:18:17 - 00:21:20:21 Whereas like if you look at the graph in the mural community, 00:21:20:21 - 00:21:23:02 everyone's like, oh, mimic stuff is amazing, 00:21:23:02 - 00:21:26:07 but mimic can't go do it or couldn't have gone down and done it 00:21:26:12 - 00:21:29:15 broad daylight whereas Christopher Griffin can. 00:21:30:04 - 00:21:30:11 Right. 00:21:30:11 - 00:21:32:04 Because everybody in the communities like oh Christopher 00:21:32:04 - 00:21:34:23 thank you for covering that up where we're like wait a second. 00:21:34:23 - 00:21:37:17 Like you see the piece sits on our building mimics. 00:21:37:17 - 00:21:38:16 And it's amazing. 00:21:38:16 - 00:21:40:15 And if you gave him the opportunity to go do it 00:21:40:15 - 00:21:43:03 broad daylight without getting arrested, 00:21:43:03 - 00:21:45:12 you know, it's, it would be amazing for sure. 00:21:45:12 - 00:21:46:04 Right? 00:21:46:04 - 00:21:48:17 So there's that double standard, too, of how we see our spaces. 00:21:48:17 - 00:21:52:00 And there needs to be room for everybody and make more space for graffiti 00:21:52:00 - 00:21:54:22 artists in our city without having to always buff them out, 00:21:54:22 - 00:21:56:18 because we always just expect that it's just going to be like, 00:21:56:18 - 00:21:59:20 oh, that's not what people want, but maybe they do want more of that. 00:22:00:09 - 00:22:04:05 But like, you know, shout outs to the NCC for all the work that they've been doing 00:22:04:05 - 00:22:09:05 over the last few years, 100%, they are starting to actually 00:22:09:05 - 00:22:13:13 pay attention to some of these communities that look at the city in different ways. 00:22:13:13 - 00:22:14:14 Yeah, and they're starting 00:22:14:14 - 00:22:17:21 to cater to those communities and work with those communities. 00:22:17:21 - 00:22:21:14 You know, like the project that you're referring to is just having more 00:22:21:18 - 00:22:23:22 legal skate spots in the city. 00:22:23:22 - 00:22:26:22 So, you know, 00:22:26:22 - 00:22:31:06 the park across from, archives, I forget what it's called. 00:22:31:10 - 00:22:34:13 The Centennial Park, I think something garden of Providence. 00:22:34:20 - 00:22:35:11 Oh, yeah. Yeah. 00:22:35:11 - 00:22:37:08 We always just refer to it as archives like that. 00:22:37:08 - 00:22:39:00 There's always, like, the the skate spot, 00:22:39:00 - 00:22:42:03 but there's such great, like, lines and architecture in that space. 00:22:42:03 - 00:22:42:22 It's great. Yeah. 00:22:42:22 - 00:22:46:19 You know, and like the fact that, like, years ago, they put skate 00:22:46:19 - 00:22:51:02 stoppers on all of the ledges and then, you know, ten years later 00:22:51:04 - 00:22:54:19 they're removing some of those skate stoppers to let skaters skate the spot. 00:22:54:19 - 00:22:57:19 Like it's super cool that they are recognizing 00:22:57:19 - 00:23:01:03 that this space is used in multiple ways. 00:23:01:03 - 00:23:01:18 Yeah. 00:23:01:18 - 00:23:05:11 And, you know, incorporate that into the identity of it 00:23:05:11 - 00:23:08:02 rather than like trying to push these people away. 00:23:08:02 - 00:23:12:13 Why not have it incorporated into like the make up of what this space is all about? 00:23:12:13 - 00:23:13:08 Right. 00:23:13:08 - 00:23:16:04 It's creating this sense of play within the city. 00:23:16:04 - 00:23:18:08 And the same goes with graffiti. 00:23:18:08 - 00:23:22:07 I mean, this city is lacking in artistic expression, 00:23:22:07 - 00:23:27:05 in terms of like murals and, and just cool art that can be, displayed in the city. 00:23:27:17 - 00:23:30:21 So to have more murals and for the NCC to be 00:23:31:15 - 00:23:34:16 not only in support of it, but paying artists to go 00:23:34:17 - 00:23:39:02 and paint all this stuff, like that's just we're heading in the right direction. 00:23:39:02 - 00:23:42:08 And I got a lot of hope for the city in terms of like, 00:23:43:19 - 00:23:44:02 I don't know, 00:23:44:02 - 00:23:47:05 breathing more life and allowing for this expression to 00:23:47:06 - 00:23:50:19 I would definitely say a big shout out to Ian for that because, Ian's the one 00:23:50:19 - 00:23:53:19 that not only did the collaboration with your brother at Berlin, 00:23:53:21 - 00:23:57:14 but he's also the one that may disrupt 2020 for a huge success 00:23:57:14 - 00:24:01:09 and gave us a 400ft wall, another 100ft community wall, for sure. 00:24:01:09 - 00:24:02:23 He's the one that encouraged that. 00:24:02:23 - 00:24:05:18 We had graffiti on it, and that we incorporated that 00:24:05:18 - 00:24:09:02 into the walls of a very like, prominent location. 00:24:09:02 - 00:24:12:10 And it's something that, you know, I'm pretty sure the wall is probably kind 00:24:12:10 - 00:24:14:21 of like heritage in a sense. It's been there forever. 00:24:14:21 - 00:24:17:05 But to add that to the space, it's transformed the space. 00:24:17:05 - 00:24:18:21 And people come in here all the time 00:24:18:21 - 00:24:20:19 and they're like, wow, that space is so amazing. 00:24:20:19 - 00:24:22:14 Now I walk that every day to work. 00:24:22:14 - 00:24:24:22 And this and that, and it transformed the space. Right. 00:24:24:22 - 00:24:26:17 And he was very welcoming and open to that. 00:24:26:17 - 00:24:27:13 And he made that part 00:24:27:13 - 00:24:31:13 of that new vision of that space, because they spent a ton of money 00:24:31:13 - 00:24:34:21 trying to redo it and make the point new and the new footbridge and stuff. 00:24:34:21 - 00:24:39:16 But to have art on it was just like it, just like the cherry on the top. 00:24:39:16 - 00:24:42:09 Right. So sure. Yeah. And he was amazing to work with. 00:24:42:09 - 00:24:44:07 And I think your brother would, would say the same. 00:24:44:07 - 00:24:46:09 So we need more Ian's in this world. Yeah. 00:24:46:09 - 00:24:49:22 You know, advocating on behalf behind or on behalf 00:24:49:22 - 00:24:53:02 of, people that want to see the city in a different way, for sure. 00:24:53:02 - 00:24:57:08 And like, you know, we need to re-envision what it means to take on, like, 00:24:57:08 - 00:25:00:08 a beautification process or anything, you know, because, like, 00:25:00:10 - 00:25:03:01 you know, if flowers and gardens are your thing, great. 00:25:03:01 - 00:25:06:00 Like, I think adding more flowers and more like 00:25:06:09 - 00:25:09:00 natural elements to the urban landscape. 00:25:09:00 - 00:25:10:04 I think that would be cool. 00:25:10:04 - 00:25:11:11 It's not necessarily my thing. 00:25:11:11 - 00:25:12:23 Yeah, you go for it. 00:25:12:23 - 00:25:16:18 But, you know, like my version is having more murals in the city or 00:25:16:23 - 00:25:20:04 having spaces where skaters can go and skate a space 00:25:20:04 - 00:25:23:11 that is also being used for other purposes, you know, so I think 00:25:24:06 - 00:25:26:18 I'm just stoked that people are starting to realize, like, 00:25:26:18 - 00:25:30:23 there are different versions of making the city a little bit better. 00:25:30:23 - 00:25:35:15 And I'm glad that an organization like the NCC is actively working 00:25:35:19 - 00:25:37:15 with communities to make this better. 00:25:37:15 - 00:25:40:23 Yeah, if you had to give one of them up skating or painting murals. 00:25:40:23 - 00:25:43:00 Oh geez, it's me. 00:25:44:03 - 00:25:45:21 I mean, at this point in my life, 00:25:45:21 - 00:25:49:16 if I had to give up one, I'd probably say skateboarding. 00:25:49:16 - 00:25:50:04 Really? 00:25:50:04 - 00:25:53:07 I love skateboarding on your body, but yeah, exactly. 00:25:53:07 - 00:25:56:00 Like I'm I'm getting I mean, painting, you can see the end. 00:25:56:00 - 00:25:59:00 I just, you know, like, I love skating and I'm, I will do it 00:25:59:00 - 00:26:02:06 until my body just expires. 00:26:02:06 - 00:26:06:20 But I'm gonna I'm gonna, you know, I think that for the safety 00:26:06:20 - 00:26:12:02 and for the longevity of of playing with my kids and having legs to stand on, 00:26:12:02 - 00:26:13:22 I think I would probably stick with painting. 00:26:13:22 - 00:26:14:08 Yeah. 00:26:14:08 - 00:26:18:06 And I definitely have done like, I've transitioned more towards painting 00:26:18:06 - 00:26:23:08 just because I think it's, it's a little bit safer for me to do and, yeah, yeah. 00:26:24:01 - 00:26:25:20 Your body speaks to you. Yeah. 00:26:25:20 - 00:26:29:13 I mean, I, you know, I never used to really think that way, 00:26:29:13 - 00:26:30:15 but when you have kids 00:26:30:15 - 00:26:34:15 and you want to be able to pick them up, so like that, that matters. 00:26:34:15 - 00:26:37:15 Yeah. So absolutely priorities change. Yeah. 00:26:38:06 - 00:26:40:18 So these series of questions are about your digital work 00:26:40:18 - 00:26:43:01 because you do a lot of murals but you also do a lot of digital work. 00:26:43:01 - 00:26:43:16 Yeah. Yeah. 00:26:43:16 - 00:26:46:16 So beyond murals and graffiti you do a lot of digital artwork. 00:26:46:16 - 00:26:48:02 What got you into that? 00:26:48:02 - 00:26:51:21 And how does working digitally compare to painting walls and like, 00:26:51:21 - 00:26:54:04 how do they kind of complement each other as well too? 00:26:54:04 - 00:26:58:03 I mean, when I the digital art that I do is all just done on my iPad 00:26:58:03 - 00:26:58:23 through procreate. 00:26:58:23 - 00:27:02:09 And I think like when I first got introduced to that app, it like blew 00:27:02:09 - 00:27:02:22 me away. 00:27:02:22 - 00:27:06:13 Like, I like I had always done sketches on paper and whatnot. 00:27:06:13 - 00:27:09:13 But I mean, procreate is just 00:27:10:00 - 00:27:14:16 a tablet application like that can allow you to just do designs 00:27:14:16 - 00:27:17:10 and do line work and all these different kinds of effects 00:27:17:10 - 00:27:20:10 that I could never really replicate, just pen and paper. 00:27:20:15 - 00:27:23:13 So, you know, I but 00:27:23:13 - 00:27:28:16 I have very little knowledge of like Adobe Photoshop or Adobe Illustrator. 00:27:28:17 - 00:27:32:06 So like, you know, I do digital illustrations, but really it's just 00:27:32:21 - 00:27:36:00 taking the stuff that I was always doing on paper 00:27:36:00 - 00:27:38:16 and just doing it on my iPad instead, you know? 00:27:38:16 - 00:27:42:00 So like with, with whatever kind of approach I take to art, 00:27:42:15 - 00:27:45:14 I always like to sort of incorporate one foot in the old world 00:27:45:14 - 00:27:46:21 and one foot in the new right. 00:27:46:21 - 00:27:47:13 Like, I, 00:27:47:13 - 00:27:50:14 I don't think that I should just abandon everything that I've been doing 00:27:50:14 - 00:27:52:06 with sketching on paper. 00:27:52:06 - 00:27:53:21 I like to just take that 00:27:53:21 - 00:27:57:17 and use technology to leverage it and to make it cooler. 00:27:57:17 - 00:27:58:15 You know? 00:27:58:15 - 00:28:04:11 So it's cool that I can, like, do a drawing on my iPad and then just have it. 00:28:05:08 - 00:28:07:18 It's able to be printed as a sticker 00:28:07:18 - 00:28:11:05 or like as a t shirt design, or blow it up really big. 00:28:11:05 - 00:28:15:17 And you know, when I'm making stencils now, like I can do a digital version of it 00:28:15:17 - 00:28:19:11 and then I can send that over to someone who can do like, laser cut for me. 00:28:19:22 - 00:28:21:22 So I think it's awesome. 00:28:21:22 - 00:28:25:13 And it's, it's something that I'm going to continue doing. 00:28:25:13 - 00:28:29:16 Just because it's, I feel like I'm barely scratching the surface of it. 00:28:29:16 - 00:28:32:10 And I hope to learn more as I go along. 00:28:32:10 - 00:28:36:00 But, yeah, it's it's just, it's just 00:28:36:00 - 00:28:39:19 a simple transfer of, like, what I was already doing into, a new space. 00:28:39:21 - 00:28:41:13 And like, how you mentioned that you're like, 00:28:41:13 - 00:28:44:01 you know, you're just kind of new to the digital art thing. Yeah. 00:28:44:01 - 00:28:45:15 And you mentioned Photoshop and Illustrator, 00:28:45:15 - 00:28:49:00 but I really think that those two software programs were kind of like a stopgap 00:28:49:00 - 00:28:52:13 to what we really wanted with digital drawing anyway, which is just going 00:28:52:13 - 00:28:55:13 directly to the tablet, which to me makes more sense. 00:28:55:18 - 00:29:00:09 Like, yeah, I mean, like if I wanted to do like a curvy shape or something, 00:29:00:09 - 00:29:05:23 I could maybe bring it into, Photoshop and give it like that really clean look. 00:29:06:01 - 00:29:06:19 Right. 00:29:06:19 - 00:29:10:06 But what I actually like about the drawings that I do on procreate 00:29:10:06 - 00:29:13:22 is that sometimes they are a little bumpy, and sometimes they are a little, like, 00:29:13:22 - 00:29:14:21 not perfect. 00:29:14:21 - 00:29:18:07 Yeah, but that's exactly how it would be if I was painting your drawing. 00:29:18:22 - 00:29:20:14 When I paint a piece is never going to be perfect. 00:29:20:14 - 00:29:23:02 There's always those little imperfections in the imperfections. 00:29:23:02 - 00:29:26:18 Give it that human quality, you know, and that's something that's lost. 00:29:26:18 - 00:29:29:12 So this piece is basically the stencil is done through procreate. 00:29:29:12 - 00:29:31:16 You basically did it and then have the stencil cut out. 00:29:31:16 - 00:29:34:01 Yeah, yeah, yeah. So cool as merch. 00:29:34:01 - 00:29:38:07 Yeah I'm still like every time I do one of these designs, it's 00:29:38:07 - 00:29:43:14 just then I have this design and I can copy it and I can cut it up 00:29:43:14 - 00:29:45:07 and I can do all these different things to it. 00:29:45:07 - 00:29:47:00 You know, it's like back in the day, 00:29:47:00 - 00:29:49:16 it was like when you had a sketch, that was it. You had the sketch. 00:29:49:16 - 00:29:53:08 But there's so much more capabilities in terms of like playing around 00:29:53:08 - 00:29:54:22 with the design and transforming it 00:29:54:22 - 00:29:58:23 and using one element of it and mixing it with another element from another design. 00:29:58:23 - 00:30:00:07 It's it's cool that way. 00:30:00:07 - 00:30:04:03 It's weird seeing like old school stencil artists like, take their stuff, 00:30:04:03 - 00:30:06:08 photocopy it, and then physically cut it out. 00:30:06:08 - 00:30:09:06 Yeah, I don't know if I've done that. It's it's crazy. 00:30:09:06 - 00:30:10:19 That's that's how we used to do it. Yeah. 00:30:10:19 - 00:30:13:00 That's nuts. Yeah. 00:30:13:00 - 00:30:13:17 On that too. 00:30:13:17 - 00:30:15:20 I think that we talked about maybe doing some workshops 00:30:15:20 - 00:30:17:15 with this too, because the stencil is so cool 00:30:17:15 - 00:30:19:00 and it gives so much creative freedom 00:30:19:00 - 00:30:22:00 with the backdrop and stuff like that, that it would be really interesting 00:30:22:02 - 00:30:24:17 to bring people into, to learn about that a bit more, too. 00:30:24:17 - 00:30:24:20 Yeah. 00:30:24:20 - 00:30:27:20 Cause I think Andy's classes were well-received with the digital art. 00:30:28:04 - 00:30:29:04 Oh, absolutely. 00:30:29:04 - 00:30:32:01 And even actually learning how to do the digital art component, 00:30:32:01 - 00:30:34:13 to turning into a stencil, to turning it into something 00:30:34:13 - 00:30:36:10 that spray painted is a really cool concept. 00:30:36:10 - 00:30:38:13 So for sure it has a super cool look to it. 00:30:38:13 - 00:30:39:21 I can't wait for everybody to see it. 00:30:39:21 - 00:30:42:00 And it was interesting to see too, because Andy's work, 00:30:42:00 - 00:30:44:12 he had a show just before the show that's up now. 00:30:44:12 - 00:30:45:12 He doesn't use procreate. 00:30:45:12 - 00:30:46:23 He use a digital process. 00:30:46:23 - 00:30:48:14 A different process as well, too. Yeah. 00:30:48:14 - 00:30:49:23 So it's interesting to see different artists 00:30:49:23 - 00:30:51:10 using different techniques to do that. 00:30:51:10 - 00:30:54:10 But essentially he was drawing on an iPad as well too, which is interesting. 00:30:54:14 - 00:30:55:01 Yeah. 00:30:55:01 - 00:30:58:15 Yeah, I mean, I, I try to learn new things every now 00:30:58:15 - 00:31:01:20 and then, but I don't try to push it too much. 00:31:01:20 - 00:31:03:19 I really just, like, procreate. 00:31:03:19 - 00:31:05:09 So good. Yeah. 00:31:05:09 - 00:31:06:04 So good. 00:31:06:04 - 00:31:07:02 Procreate was awesome. 00:31:07:02 - 00:31:10:12 Just because, like, I'm like, oh, so I can just still draw on this thing. 00:31:10:12 - 00:31:13:09 It's just like, I can just change the width of my lines and everything. 00:31:13:09 - 00:31:16:00 I'm like, cool. You know? Like, it's still something that I'm familiar with. 00:31:16:00 - 00:31:16:06 Yeah. 00:31:16:06 - 00:31:19:04 I didn't have to, like, learn a bunch of new things, you know? 00:31:19:04 - 00:31:20:17 And I kind of like it that way. 00:31:20:17 - 00:31:22:17 And the other programs are a little bit more intense. 00:31:22:17 - 00:31:24:23 Like, I'm super, like, well versed in Photoshop, 00:31:24:23 - 00:31:26:15 but like, I mean, new in software, everything. 00:31:26:15 - 00:31:30:10 But for him to say that procreate is so good, amazing coming 00:31:30:10 - 00:31:33:19 from someone that uses illustrator and InDesign and all the different things. 00:31:34:05 - 00:31:36:23 Because it's like, like you said, it's it's like something that's like, 00:31:36:23 - 00:31:38:14 really like accessible to people to 00:31:38:14 - 00:31:41:16 right where you don't have to, like, learn extensive amounts of stuff to use it. 00:31:41:16 - 00:31:44:14 You can draw. Yeah. Which is what you want to do. 00:31:44:14 - 00:31:44:19 Yeah. 00:31:44:19 - 00:31:47:20 I mean, I like I give my son the tablet every now and then 00:31:47:20 - 00:31:50:15 and he'll just kind of like do a few drawings. Yeah. 00:31:50:15 - 00:31:53:04 And he's always amazed at what he comes up with, you know. 00:31:53:04 - 00:31:56:13 So I think if you can draw something that you're, 00:31:57:00 - 00:31:59:14 that you would have normally drawn on a piece of paper anyway. 00:31:59:14 - 00:31:59:20 Yeah. 00:31:59:20 - 00:32:02:07 But you do it in procreate, it just, 00:32:02:07 - 00:32:04:05 I don't know, like it, it hits you a little bit different. 00:32:04:05 - 00:32:04:22 And it's, 00:32:04:22 - 00:32:08:02 it's weird to see the younger generation sort of interact with tablets 00:32:08:02 - 00:32:09:13 versus computers. 00:32:09:13 - 00:32:12:09 I know Abby was in front of a desktop the other day, 00:32:12:09 - 00:32:16:01 and she was just like, what is this like, why would you use a mouse? 00:32:16:01 - 00:32:19:07 Like when you can touch screen and write on it with a pencil or a pen? 00:32:19:07 - 00:32:22:07 I think you're going to see a generation of people looking at us going, 00:32:22:12 - 00:32:24:02 how are you using computing like that? 00:32:25:06 - 00:32:26:22 Because everything should be more interactive. 00:32:26:22 - 00:32:28:05 Yeah, more touchable. 00:32:28:05 - 00:32:28:23 It should be. 00:32:28:23 - 00:32:32:03 But there's value in like exploring like the old ways of 00:32:32:04 - 00:32:34:05 of course, you know, just like old drawing and stuff. 00:32:34:05 - 00:32:35:19 It's kind of bringing those old techniques back. 00:32:35:19 - 00:32:38:17 But it's interesting to see younger kids interact like that. 00:32:38:17 - 00:32:40:01 Yeah, yeah. 00:32:40:01 - 00:32:43:14 What do you love about digital art that you don't get from murals 00:32:43:14 - 00:32:45:10 or graffiti and, vice versa? 00:32:45:10 - 00:32:48:10 What keeps you coming back to painting large scale walls? 00:32:49:02 - 00:32:53:04 I think what keeps me coming back to is to painting large scale walls is just. 00:32:53:04 - 00:32:55:16 That's what drew me to it in the first place. 00:32:55:16 - 00:32:59:02 And like, if I start painting walls, then that's it. 00:32:59:02 - 00:33:02:16 I'm not, you know, paint anymore like it's it's and it's happy to hear. 00:33:02:16 - 00:33:03:18 Yeah. Keep going. 00:33:03:18 - 00:33:07:22 That's that's where like the it all started so I, I like doing that. 00:33:08:12 - 00:33:11:09 It's a it's a totally different vibe you know 00:33:11:09 - 00:33:15:00 like if I'm going to go paint a wall I'm there for the full day. 00:33:15:05 - 00:33:16:22 I'm listening to music. 00:33:16:22 - 00:33:19:10 Usually I'm working with other artists, I'm talking to them. 00:33:19:10 - 00:33:21:12 It's a lot more collaborative. 00:33:21:12 - 00:33:24:15 But you know, all those times where I just want to, like, 00:33:25:00 - 00:33:28:13 sit on my couch at the end of the day and just kind of do a quick drawing. 00:33:28:13 - 00:33:29:22 Then I can sit down on my couch. 00:33:29:22 - 00:33:33:11 And it's a really comfortable kind of like solo setting. 00:33:33:11 - 00:33:36:07 So I like to paint a wall when I want to talk to people 00:33:36:07 - 00:33:39:07 and when I want to actually like when I've got a little bit more energy. 00:33:39:10 - 00:33:42:23 Yeah, but the digital stuff is just something that I can kind of like. 00:33:42:23 - 00:33:47:11 It's my me time, you know, like that's that's where I kind of just, sit back 00:33:47:11 - 00:33:52:17 and enjoy just interacting with, with the, the technology. 00:33:52:19 - 00:33:55:03 So introverted decks is digital. 00:33:55:03 - 00:33:57:21 Yeah. Extroverted decks you to have a balance, you know. 00:33:57:21 - 00:34:00:18 Oh you gotta I wonder what and Beaver Vertex does, you know. 00:34:00:18 - 00:34:01:10 So yeah. 00:34:03:01 - 00:34:06:01 We'll have to ask him next time he's here. 00:34:06:19 - 00:34:08:18 So you work has been part of projects 00:34:08:18 - 00:34:12:00 like House of paint, revitalizing urban spaces through murals. 00:34:12:11 - 00:34:16:10 How does it feel to contribute to as, street art scene in, like, such a big way? 00:34:17:04 - 00:34:18:09 Oh, I mean, it's so cool. 00:34:18:09 - 00:34:21:20 Like, it's it's sweet that I can take my son and my family 00:34:21:20 - 00:34:26:12 to different spots of the city where I have murals up and, you know, 00:34:27:01 - 00:34:31:13 show them what it's like to actually contribute 00:34:31:13 - 00:34:35:12 to the community and make it a little bit of a brighter space. 00:34:35:17 - 00:34:39:10 So I I'm honored and I'm grateful. 00:34:39:10 - 00:34:42:17 I think, like at times I kind of almost feel like an imposter 00:34:43:04 - 00:34:47:10 because this was never an opportunity that I thought would come my way. 00:34:47:10 - 00:34:49:14 You know, I always just thought I'd be, like, 00:34:49:14 - 00:34:52:21 painting in alleyways for the rest of my life and, 00:34:52:21 - 00:34:54:12 not really getting any recognition 00:34:54:12 - 00:34:58:08 for it, but, I mean, I have to give you guys a big shout out to that 00:34:58:08 - 00:35:03:01 because I, when we first met and when we started working together, 00:35:03:09 - 00:35:06:06 you guys inspired me to to take it to another level. 00:35:06:06 - 00:35:08:12 And to take it a little bit more seriously. 00:35:08:12 - 00:35:09:06 So it's cool. 00:35:09:06 - 00:35:13:04 I still have that element of fun, and I do really enjoy doing it. 00:35:13:04 - 00:35:15:18 And if I didn't enjoy doing it, I wouldn't keep doing it. 00:35:15:18 - 00:35:20:14 But, I just like the, the, the extra push that I get 00:35:20:14 - 00:35:24:12 from these projects and, and the fact that people actually like the work that I do. 00:35:24:12 - 00:35:25:19 And I'm just honored. 00:35:25:19 - 00:35:28:05 It's, it's it's a really cool thing. Thanks, man. 00:35:28:05 - 00:35:28:15 That's awesome. 00:35:28:15 - 00:35:31:18 So it's people like you that we saw the artwork in the alleyways 00:35:31:18 - 00:35:34:10 and we're like, we want, we gotta get this everywhere. 00:35:34:10 - 00:35:35:06 Where are these people? 00:35:35:06 - 00:35:37:15 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:35:37:15 - 00:35:40:22 And you were one of the first people like we really connected with on that too, 00:35:40:22 - 00:35:43:21 that we were just like wow. Like especially graffiti. Right? 00:35:43:21 - 00:35:47:10 Like I think that's something that is a little bit more underground in the city. 00:35:47:10 - 00:35:51:08 So it's like getting to know more graffiti artists and understanding the culture 00:35:51:08 - 00:35:53:13 more as something that's really like, 00:35:53:13 - 00:35:56:02 like we've always loved also like street art, right? 00:35:56:02 - 00:35:59:11 Like it's always been super like deep rooted in our souls, but like getting 00:35:59:11 - 00:36:03:02 to learn more about the culture and and being in and being like 00:36:03:07 - 00:36:08:00 and invited into the culture is, is very, it's it's rewarding for us too, 00:36:08:00 - 00:36:10:18 because we love it and we just want to see more of it in the, in the city. 00:36:10:18 - 00:36:13:04 So I mean, we were usually like, I grew up in Toronto. 00:36:13:04 - 00:36:14:14 I was exposed to that scene. 00:36:14:14 - 00:36:16:13 Montreal was my training 00:36:16:13 - 00:36:18:04 and then coming here and then starting this, 00:36:18:04 - 00:36:20:00 it was that there's so much talent in the city, 00:36:20:00 - 00:36:24:01 and you don't see a lot of the stuff, like you were saying on major walls that 00:36:24:01 - 00:36:27:09 you see throughout the city, you see it and the alleyways and stuff like that. 00:36:27:09 - 00:36:29:07 And we want to bring that forward a little bit more. 00:36:29:07 - 00:36:31:03 We still want the alleyways to, of course, 00:36:31:03 - 00:36:34:22 like seeing it on bigger walls, like that's yeah, that's what we need. 00:36:35:03 - 00:36:36:08 Yeah. Yeah. 00:36:36:08 - 00:36:39:08 I mean, there was always this notion of like selling out when, 00:36:39:08 - 00:36:43:12 when I was growing up, like, you know, the, the hardcore graffiti dudes 00:36:43:12 - 00:36:47:16 would be opposed to anybody who would, like, get paid for a job or, 00:36:47:16 - 00:36:50:15 or do any kind of like, commercial gigs with their graffiti. 00:36:51:04 - 00:36:55:09 But, so, you know, I think that we, we do have to hold on to at least 00:36:55:13 - 00:36:58:15 some of that because there's this, like, underground element to it. 00:36:58:15 - 00:37:02:05 And, you know, I think there's, it's cool 00:37:02:05 - 00:37:05:07 and we gotta keep at least a little bit of that outlook alive. 00:37:05:10 - 00:37:06:18 But I think that's like what you were mentioning 00:37:06:18 - 00:37:08:07 about the NCC, about skate culture. 00:37:08:07 - 00:37:11:19 And you know, obviously disrupt with us is that bridging gaps. 00:37:11:19 - 00:37:14:09 And I think you're seeing people that are sort of growing up 00:37:14:09 - 00:37:18:07 through that scene, getting into positions like that and saying, well, that's 00:37:18:07 - 00:37:20:02 what I grew up with. Why don't I see this? 00:37:20:02 - 00:37:23:19 Or just like you said, flowers are great, but yeah, we kind of want murals 00:37:23:19 - 00:37:26:23 and that's what we want nowadays and we want a combination of both. 00:37:27:05 - 00:37:28:03 So I think that like, 00:37:28:03 - 00:37:30:06 I don't know where it is in our question that I don't care at this point 00:37:30:06 - 00:37:32:08 because I think it's a really good intro to that. 00:37:32:08 - 00:37:36:05 When we started talking to you about doing a Graph Dads thing, it's 00:37:36:05 - 00:37:38:10 because graph art has kept coming in here 00:37:38:10 - 00:37:40:04 and they're like, oh, I can't do graph anymore 00:37:40:04 - 00:37:42:18 because my wife is this and that and like doesn't let me do it. 00:37:42:18 - 00:37:43:21 And we're like, I'm like, oh my gosh. 00:37:43:21 - 00:37:45:03 They're like, I love doing it. 00:37:45:03 - 00:37:48:04 But I'm not allowed to anymore because I have, you know, kids and this and that. 00:37:48:15 - 00:37:51:04 And there's this like deep rooted like desire to 00:37:51:04 - 00:37:54:09 still want to do it, but you're not in a position to do it. 00:37:56:01 - 00:37:57:04 Illegally, if we want 00:37:57:04 - 00:38:00:08 to call it what what society tells us is illegal, right. 00:38:00:21 - 00:38:02:17 Let's frame the graph dads thing first. 00:38:02:17 - 00:38:05:17 So I mean, the one thing that I mean because not everyone knows. 00:38:05:17 - 00:38:06:23 So basically just 00:38:06:23 - 00:38:10:02 if people understand what it is scruff dads, it's we're going on for profit. 00:38:10:02 - 00:38:12:00 And that's one of the things that we want to start. 00:38:12:00 - 00:38:15:03 We want to start a group of graffiti artists who 00:38:15:08 - 00:38:18:20 and urban artists who are doing stuff to basically mentor young people. 00:38:19:00 - 00:38:19:08 Yeah. 00:38:19:08 - 00:38:22:01 And I think it's a way for you guys to really, like, get out there 00:38:22:01 - 00:38:24:07 still and have that community and still build on that 00:38:24:07 - 00:38:27:04 and really do what you love, but do it in a way, like, 00:38:27:04 - 00:38:29:10 because a lot of times we're like, hey, can we take your picture? 00:38:29:10 - 00:38:31:19 And you're like, I'm just, I just want to create art, right? 00:38:31:19 - 00:38:34:19 Like, I love creating art and you want to, you know, show your kids 00:38:34:19 - 00:38:37:16 how to make art and stuff like that too, right? On the, on the walls. 00:38:37:16 - 00:38:41:05 And, and I think that that's where Graph dads is kind of like a mentorship thing. 00:38:41:05 - 00:38:41:13 And it's it's 00:38:41:13 - 00:38:44:15 just a way to have jams in the city with people and like be able to, like, 00:38:44:15 - 00:38:45:15 support them in ways. 00:38:45:15 - 00:38:48:15 As you said, mentorship was exactly the beginning of the podcast 00:38:48:17 - 00:38:49:23 when you talked about mentorship. 00:38:49:23 - 00:38:51:09 Yeah, yeah, for sure. 00:38:51:09 - 00:38:52:03 And I think if we want 00:38:52:03 - 00:38:55:03 to keep that culture alive, I think that's something that, you know, 00:38:55:07 - 00:38:58:07 this generation's got to do for a future generations to keep on going, 00:38:58:07 - 00:38:59:22 but that sort of thing as well, too. 00:38:59:22 - 00:39:03:11 I think it's also interesting to be part of, like the evolution of it all 00:39:03:12 - 00:39:06:11 because like, you know, nowadays 00:39:06:11 - 00:39:09:14 graffiti is a lot more accepted than it was when I first started. 00:39:09:14 - 00:39:10:03 Yeah. 00:39:10:03 - 00:39:13:06 And we never really had a lot of those 00:39:13:06 - 00:39:16:12 like mature older like individuals. 00:39:16:12 - 00:39:20:01 I mean, like I talked about my mentor and how much I learned, but you know, like 00:39:20:12 - 00:39:24:10 this whole like, new approach to graffiti and how like, you know, 00:39:24:10 - 00:39:27:17 we can use it to actually better the community instead of 00:39:27:17 - 00:39:32:04 just keeping it within, like our own little pocket of the city. 00:39:32:04 - 00:39:36:21 You know, there's a lot of opportunity to use it in positive ways. 00:39:36:21 - 00:39:38:12 And I'm super down to do that. 00:39:38:12 - 00:39:39:00 You know, like, 00:39:39:00 - 00:39:44:06 I think that a lot of people can benefit from, getting into the world of graffiti. 00:39:44:06 - 00:39:49:19 It's done wonders for for my life and my sort of growth as an individual. 00:39:50:03 - 00:39:53:13 So if I can impart some of that wisdom to the younger generation 00:39:53:20 - 00:39:57:10 and help steer them towards like a more positive outlook on like what 00:39:57:10 - 00:39:58:22 you can actually do with this. 00:39:58:22 - 00:40:00:16 Yeah, I think it's important. 00:40:00:16 - 00:40:01:03 Yeah. 00:40:01:03 - 00:40:02:11 There's a lot of people struggling to 00:40:02:11 - 00:40:04:23 I know a lot of the younger kids are struggling right now, 00:40:04:23 - 00:40:06:01 like people want a voice. 00:40:06:01 - 00:40:07:16 And I think that's why people get into graffiti 00:40:07:16 - 00:40:09:09 is to say something and have something to say. 00:40:09:09 - 00:40:11:15 And we want them to have a voice. Yeah. Yeah. 00:40:11:15 - 00:40:13:17 So Dex is now in charge of that. 00:40:13:17 - 00:40:16:00 Yeah. DEKS as the king of the graft as 00:40:17:13 - 00:40:18:17 I think he's the graph. 00:40:18:17 - 00:40:20:15 He's the graph daddy. Yeah. 00:40:20:15 - 00:40:23:15 The idea kind of came about when we were doing 00:40:24:02 - 00:40:27:02 jam in the Byward market 00:40:27:02 - 00:40:30:02 and I just oh my gosh, this is my favorite story. 00:40:30:14 - 00:40:30:21 Yeah. 00:40:30:21 - 00:40:33:07 Well, I mean, we got this opportunity 00:40:33:07 - 00:40:37:06 to paint panels inside, like the pavilion at the Byward Market. 00:40:37:06 - 00:40:38:13 And it was a wonderful gallery. 00:40:38:13 - 00:40:40:09 55. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:40:40:09 - 00:40:43:19 But, you know, we got, tasked with coming up 00:40:43:19 - 00:40:47:00 with a team of, like, 20 artists to come and paint these panels. 00:40:47:00 - 00:40:49:18 And, you know, I'm not on social media. 00:40:49:18 - 00:40:51:22 I'm not really as connected with, like, the, 00:40:51:22 - 00:40:55:00 the current community just because I've got other priorities. 00:40:55:08 - 00:40:59:11 So I had to reach out to all of my old graffiti friends from back in the day. 00:40:59:11 - 00:41:01:20 So we we managed to get together and like it. 00:41:01:20 - 00:41:06:23 It just happened that like there was a bunch of panels in a row of dads 00:41:06:23 - 00:41:10:01 that are just kind of coming back into graffiti and painting these pieces. 00:41:10:01 - 00:41:13:01 So the idea of graph dads kind of came out of that. 00:41:13:07 - 00:41:17:01 And, it was really cool to not only, 00:41:17:01 - 00:41:20:06 like reconnect with some of these old artists, but to to see 00:41:21:00 - 00:41:25:09 the changes in, in their, sort of outlook on graffiti. 00:41:25:09 - 00:41:29:09 And it was, it was really cool to, to hang out with them all again and paint 00:41:29:09 - 00:41:31:10 a piece. It's been a long time from an outsider. 00:41:31:10 - 00:41:32:23 It was very cool to go into that, 00:41:32:23 - 00:41:34:07 to see that, because we expected 00:41:34:07 - 00:41:36:21 there was gonna be like a bunch of hardcore graph guys, 00:41:36:21 - 00:41:39:15 and we get in there and they're like school pick ups and like, 00:41:39:15 - 00:41:41:14 you know, talking about babies and all this stuff. 00:41:41:14 - 00:41:43:12 And I was like, what is even happening here? Right? 00:41:43:12 - 00:41:46:04 I think it was like Nick was the only one that was a girl. 00:41:46:04 - 00:41:48:03 They were painting and everybody else was talking 00:41:48:03 - 00:41:50:03 about all this stuff, and it's all dad related stuff. 00:41:50:03 - 00:41:52:11 And I was like, I don't even understand what I'm in. Like, what is this? 00:41:52:11 - 00:41:53:20 I thought this was like a graph jam, right? 00:41:53:20 - 00:41:57:02 And it was so fun to talk to them about how like, you know, 00:41:57:03 - 00:42:00:07 oh, I got to get home early and stuff and it's, it's it's a perspective of like, 00:42:00:07 - 00:42:02:19 your life has shifted. You have other responsibilities. 00:42:02:19 - 00:42:07:01 You still want to be a graffiti artist, but you were also a husband and a dad. 00:42:07:06 - 00:42:09:03 And you have these responsibilities, right? 00:42:09:03 - 00:42:10:21 So it was very cool. 00:42:10:21 - 00:42:13:07 So that's where the the Graph dad thing was hilarious. 00:42:13:07 - 00:42:14:17 And I still tell everybody about that 00:42:14:17 - 00:42:17:05 because it was the funniest thing I've ever witnessed. 00:42:17:05 - 00:42:19:04 And the work was amazing, right? 00:42:19:04 - 00:42:20:18 It was just it was awesome. 00:42:20:18 - 00:42:24:08 So I mean for that since we threw that out there, if anyone's interested. 00:42:24:08 - 00:42:26:19 Listening. Right. We we need graph dads. 00:42:26:19 - 00:42:29:12 This is like yeah who do they reach out to. Do you want us to. Yeah. 00:42:29:12 - 00:42:31:18 They can reach out to us. Reach out to us. Yeah. Or. 00:42:31:18 - 00:42:33:15 Yeah. Because Dex isn't really on socials. 00:42:33:15 - 00:42:36:06 So yeah. Like but I'm, I'm down to connect. 00:42:36:06 - 00:42:39:10 I'm down and connect with other people who have that same sort 00:42:39:10 - 00:42:42:12 of, like mindedness when it comes to this. 00:42:42:12 - 00:42:48:01 You know, if, if you're one who maybe, dabbled in graffiti or, you know, 00:42:48:05 - 00:42:51:15 we're really into it at some point, but maybe things have changed. 00:42:51:22 - 00:42:56:14 And, you know, you want to maybe start exploring it again, like, it's, 00:42:56:15 - 00:42:59:15 I think, like we need to start looking at, like, different versions of, 00:42:59:17 - 00:43:01:20 yeah, what the world of graffiti could look like. 00:43:01:20 - 00:43:05:06 And, you know, it's just cool to see people 00:43:05:06 - 00:43:08:15 that feel the same way, you know, and we're still keeping it real. 00:43:08:15 - 00:43:09:03 Like we're not. 00:43:09:03 - 00:43:13:03 They're trying to pretend like we don't care about our kids or, 00:43:13:03 - 00:43:14:17 you know, like, you know, 00:43:15:20 - 00:43:16:09 having that 00:43:16:09 - 00:43:20:14 sort of like, old school mentality of just, like, vandalism and delinquents 00:43:20:14 - 00:43:23:12 and all that, you know, like, oh, you're keeping it real because life just changes. 00:43:23:12 - 00:43:26:14 And that's like, that's the thing that's never changed. 00:43:26:14 - 00:43:27:17 We keep it real, you know? 00:43:27:17 - 00:43:31:14 Like when we were younger, we were stupid adolescents. 00:43:31:14 - 00:43:32:06 But, you know, 00:43:32:06 - 00:43:36:06 now we're older, we have priorities, we've got kids and we're more mature. 00:43:36:06 - 00:43:38:09 And we keep it real. Like, that's that's just it. 00:43:38:09 - 00:43:41:00 We were stupid adolescents, too. Yeah, yeah. 00:43:41:00 - 00:43:42:08 So links down below 00:43:42:08 - 00:43:45:05 if you want to email us or talk to us through social about that. 00:43:45:05 - 00:43:48:09 And you can reach out to us if we want to start organizing that certain later. 00:43:48:09 - 00:43:48:15 Yeah. 00:43:48:15 - 00:43:50:05 And if you are a younger artist 00:43:50:05 - 00:43:53:12 looking for mentorship and want to be part of it, let us know. 00:43:53:16 - 00:43:55:14 So yeah, it's both ends, right? 00:43:55:14 - 00:43:57:22 People that want to kind of be the mentors and the mentees. 00:43:57:22 - 00:43:59:15 So yeah, yeah. 00:43:59:15 - 00:44:01:05 And I don't have all the answers. 00:44:01:05 - 00:44:03:15 And I'm still figuring this out as we go along. 00:44:03:15 - 00:44:07:10 But you know, I really benefit off of just like talking to people 00:44:07:10 - 00:44:09:03 that were embedded in the community. 00:44:09:03 - 00:44:09:11 Yeah. 00:44:09:11 - 00:44:12:08 And I would love to be able to pay that forward. 00:44:12:08 - 00:44:12:19 It's amazing. 00:44:12:19 - 00:44:14:18 And part of the journey is doing it together too. 00:44:14:18 - 00:44:15:22 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:44:15:22 - 00:44:18:04 And that's what actually earlier when you were painting this piece, 00:44:18:04 - 00:44:19:00 it was like 00:44:19:00 - 00:44:22:00 we were kind of going back and forth and you were talking about that how, 00:44:22:01 - 00:44:24:23 you know, you like that, sort of like when you used to paint, used to paint 00:44:24:23 - 00:44:27:08 with multiple people, and people would be like, hey, you should change this. 00:44:27:08 - 00:44:29:15 Or maybe what about this? Yeah. And you kind of built on it. 00:44:29:15 - 00:44:33:23 And if when you see the time lapse, you'll see the transformation of the piece. 00:44:34:06 - 00:44:36:16 And it was this kind of fun to even like be part of that, 00:44:36:16 - 00:44:39:05 where I was like, oh, cool, I can suggest these things to him. 00:44:39:05 - 00:44:41:09 And he just all of a sudden goes out there and just starts spraying. 00:44:41:09 - 00:44:43:07 And I was like, what's happening here? And it. 00:44:43:07 - 00:44:46:03 Yeah. So it's it's kind of interesting to see that collaborative piece. 00:44:46:03 - 00:44:48:02 And that's where even like disrupt comes in, right? 00:44:48:02 - 00:44:49:21 Where we really want it to be a collaborative thing 00:44:49:21 - 00:44:52:09 that involves mentorship and it involves community. 00:44:52:09 - 00:44:55:18 It's not just about, you know, doing spotlighting specific artists. 00:44:55:18 - 00:44:58:12 It's about working together and building something bigger, for sure. 00:44:58:12 - 00:44:59:18 Yeah. 00:44:59:18 - 00:45:02:17 So speaking of keeping it real and obviously moving forward, 00:45:02:17 - 00:45:04:19 you know, in life you're now a teacher. 00:45:04:19 - 00:45:05:22 Yeah. Yeah. 00:45:05:22 - 00:45:10:02 So basically, like, how does that influence your artwork? 00:45:10:10 - 00:45:11:11 I know you mentioned that 00:45:11:11 - 00:45:13:20 you mentioned the Latin quote when you were doing this one. 00:45:13:20 - 00:45:14:13 Yeah, yeah. 00:45:14:13 - 00:45:16:18 But I mean, over and above that, how much do you think 00:45:16:18 - 00:45:20:23 that's influenced your work as a graphic artist, as a teacher, 00:45:20:23 - 00:45:25:23 especially like as an English teacher, I get exposed to a lot of different texts. 00:45:26:15 - 00:45:30:02 And I get a lot of inspiration from my students 00:45:30:02 - 00:45:33:21 because, you know, I'll, I'll present some articles or films 00:45:33:21 - 00:45:36:22 to watch or things to do in class, but they'll come back to me 00:45:36:22 - 00:45:38:00 with their own suggestions. 00:45:38:00 - 00:45:40:14 And there's a lot of things that I've learned from them, 00:45:40:14 - 00:45:43:14 maybe even more than they've learned from me. 00:45:43:14 - 00:45:46:11 But, I, I find inspiration in that. 00:45:46:11 - 00:45:50:18 And so, like, you know, that there there are texts, poems, 00:45:50:18 - 00:45:56:05 phrases, lots of different things that my students will expose me to. 00:45:56:05 - 00:45:58:18 And that sort of leads to inspiration for artwork. Right? 00:45:58:18 - 00:46:05:07 I think that a lot of times I'll find, someone or something that inspires me 00:46:05:07 - 00:46:09:12 and that'll just kind of like create this thought that bubbles in my head 00:46:09:12 - 00:46:12:16 for about a week until I figure out how to actually represent that visually. 00:46:12:16 - 00:46:13:04 That's cool. 00:46:13:04 - 00:46:17:00 So yeah, I mean, I'd say like the biggest thing is just being inspired 00:46:17:00 - 00:46:18:15 by my students who just 00:46:18:15 - 00:46:21:21 expose me to things that I don't think I would have come to on my own. 00:46:22:07 - 00:46:23:02 That's cool. Yeah. 00:46:24:16 - 00:46:28:21 For young artists, especially those getting into graffiti, 00:46:28:21 - 00:46:30:21 what advice would you give them about making a name 00:46:30:21 - 00:46:33:21 for themselves while still respecting the culture? 00:46:35:06 - 00:46:36:09 I think 00:46:36:09 - 00:46:40:07 it's really important to stay humble. 00:46:40:19 - 00:46:43:14 And that's a hard message 00:46:43:14 - 00:46:46:14 to get across to adolescents, I know. 00:46:46:17 - 00:46:51:00 So if you are struggled with that, who is looking to get into graffiti? 00:46:51:05 - 00:46:51:10 Yeah. 00:46:51:10 - 00:46:57:11 You know, I would say just just stay humble and don't try to rush the process 00:46:57:11 - 00:47:01:16 because I think that a lot of people just want to be really good, really fast. 00:47:02:00 - 00:47:04:08 But you got to understand that it takes time. 00:47:04:08 - 00:47:07:07 And, you're probably not going to like some of the first things 00:47:07:07 - 00:47:08:03 that you come up with. 00:47:08:03 - 00:47:12:16 But if you stick with it, eventually, you know, you'll you'll get to a piece 00:47:12:16 - 00:47:13:03 where you're like, 00:47:13:03 - 00:47:17:08 I kind of like this a little bit, and then it just progresses from there. 00:47:17:17 - 00:47:21:22 So, you know, I would say, just don't be too hard on yourself. 00:47:22:16 - 00:47:25:16 Remember to have fun, because after all, that's that's why 00:47:25:16 - 00:47:30:06 we all do this anyway, and, you know, be humble. 00:47:30:06 - 00:47:36:08 Don't don't brag too much and, try to just focus on on your own progression. 00:47:36:08 - 00:47:39:08 I think, like, it's something that I tell students all the time, but, 00:47:39:18 - 00:47:42:05 don't compare yourself to others. 00:47:42:05 - 00:47:44:01 Compare yourself only to yourself. 00:47:44:01 - 00:47:45:10 You know, if you are better 00:47:45:10 - 00:47:48:10 than where you were a year ago, then you're heading in the right direction. 00:47:48:16 - 00:47:52:00 And if you're still smiling when you're painting, keep doing it. 00:47:52:01 - 00:47:52:09 Yeah. 00:47:52:09 - 00:47:55:02 And if it's not for you, then it's not for you. But. 00:47:55:02 - 00:47:55:13 Yeah. 00:47:55:13 - 00:47:59:04 Yeah, it's it's something that I think a lot of people 00:47:59:15 - 00:48:04:15 should just take easy and apply sort of an organic approach 00:48:04:15 - 00:48:07:16 to your life and realize it takes time to, to develop your style. 00:48:07:16 - 00:48:07:21 Right. 00:48:07:21 - 00:48:09:21 You're not going to get out of the gates like, well, 00:48:09:21 - 00:48:13:01 most people won't come out of the gates having that all like defined and stuff. 00:48:13:01 - 00:48:16:14 So yeah, yeah, those of us who are lucky enough to, to sort of stick 00:48:16:14 - 00:48:20:02 through all those like terrible pieces that you paint at the beginning and, 00:48:20:21 - 00:48:22:21 you know, it gets better. Yeah. 00:48:22:21 - 00:48:25:21 And yeah, I remember our first year portfolios I looked at, I was like, 00:48:25:21 - 00:48:28:08 oh gosh. I was like, what was that? You know, like in school? 00:48:28:08 - 00:48:30:11 What's that thing they always say, like your first 10,000 00:48:30:11 - 00:48:33:21 photographs or artworks are horrible and you just kind of get through it. 00:48:33:21 - 00:48:35:09 It's true. Yeah, yeah. 00:48:35:09 - 00:48:38:19 But looking back on it, I mean, that's what kind of makes you grow and adapt 00:48:38:19 - 00:48:41:19 because you look at all the mistakes and you kind of learn from that. 00:48:41:21 - 00:48:43:05 Like, yeah, it's like the light bulb. 00:48:43:05 - 00:48:45:22 You gotta keep going to get the thing. Exactly. 00:48:45:22 - 00:48:46:06 Yeah. 00:48:46:06 - 00:48:48:10 Sometimes when I look back at some of my first pieces, 00:48:48:10 - 00:48:50:14 like originally, my reaction would just be like, 00:48:50:14 - 00:48:54:12 whoa, you know, like now I'm like looking at it and I'm like, stoked. 00:48:54:12 - 00:48:55:21 I'm like, I can't believe that. 00:48:55:21 - 00:48:56:20 Like, 00:48:56:20 - 00:49:00:21 I got past that and like, you know, I it's my stuff is way better than what it was 00:49:00:21 - 00:49:01:14 when I started off. 00:49:01:14 - 00:49:04:10 So it's like, it's yeah, it's a good perspective to have on it. 00:49:04:10 - 00:49:06:08 Yeah. Kind of just being disgusted by. 00:49:06:08 - 00:49:06:19 Yeah. 00:49:06:19 - 00:49:07:10 It's always good 00:49:07:10 - 00:49:11:03 to keep some sort of representation of it too, if not the original piece for sure, 00:49:11:03 - 00:49:12:02 because I know a lot of my students, 00:49:12:02 - 00:49:14:07 they just chuck their work and I say, you got to hold onto it. 00:49:14:07 - 00:49:16:06 You gotta be able to it. It's like a diary. 00:49:16:06 - 00:49:19:06 Well, especially for like graffiti because like, you know, 00:49:19:06 - 00:49:21:08 we didn't have phones when I first started. 00:49:21:08 - 00:49:23:00 Like, we didn't have cameras on us all the time. 00:49:23:00 - 00:49:26:12 So I would have this, like eight megapixel, little, like digital camera. 00:49:26:20 - 00:49:29:01 You paint the piece and, like, you better hope 00:49:29:01 - 00:49:32:11 that there's enough battery in that camera to take one photo and that's it. 00:49:32:11 - 00:49:34:15 You know, like, you have that one photo 00:49:34:15 - 00:49:36:23 and you might not ever see that piece again. Yeah, yeah. 00:49:36:23 - 00:49:39:23 It's funny going back to skateboarding, that similarity of like, you know, 00:49:39:23 - 00:49:43:14 skateboard culture and video stills and trying to get that shot. 00:49:43:14 - 00:49:45:19 Yeah, it's literally the same thing too for sure. 00:49:45:19 - 00:49:47:14 And it's that spontaneity of it as well too. 00:49:47:14 - 00:49:50:05 It almost turns back to music too. Yeah, 100%. 00:49:50:05 - 00:49:51:09 And having that archive, 00:49:51:09 - 00:49:54:16 I know we really want an art archive for street art and for street 00:49:54:16 - 00:49:55:07 art and graffiti. 00:49:55:07 - 00:49:59:11 Yeah, because there's definitely, like you said, you have photos of stuff 00:49:59:11 - 00:50:00:23 that you've done and everybody else does. 00:50:00:23 - 00:50:03:19 And there's people that have specifically documented that for years. 00:50:03:19 - 00:50:04:03 Right. 00:50:04:03 - 00:50:07:14 So creating coffee table books and putting them in documentaries 00:50:07:14 - 00:50:08:07 and all that kind of stuff 00:50:08:07 - 00:50:11:07 is something that we would love to do and actually archive them. 00:50:11:07 - 00:50:11:13 Right. 00:50:11:13 - 00:50:14:14 And actually create like shows around them and, and stuff like that. 00:50:14:14 - 00:50:15:08 One of our big things 00:50:15:08 - 00:50:19:06 is to push for a digital online archive of Ottawa street and urban art, 00:50:19:16 - 00:50:22:19 somehow to get that done so that it can be studied, used. 00:50:23:00 - 00:50:25:15 I mean, not for any nefarious purposes, but yeah, yeah. 00:50:25:15 - 00:50:26:16 No, it's it's true. 00:50:26:16 - 00:50:30:04 It's important that we need to to hold on to that. 00:50:30:04 - 00:50:31:13 Yeah. What we do. Yeah. Yeah. 00:50:32:23 - 00:50:35:01 So current and future projects. 00:50:35:01 - 00:50:38:09 So you've recently worked on the hip hop time capsule project for House of paint. 00:50:38:10 - 00:50:38:19 Yeah. 00:50:38:19 - 00:50:41:11 What was it like contributing to something like that. 00:50:41:11 - 00:50:46:05 That will be part of Ottawa's Ottawa's cultural history for the next 20 years. 00:50:46:13 - 00:50:49:17 I mean, it was really cool, like the, the whole the, 00:50:49:17 - 00:50:53:11 art exhibit that the Ottawa Art Gallery put together for that was was awesome. 00:50:53:11 - 00:50:54:01 That was awesome. 00:50:54:01 - 00:50:54:14 Yeah, yeah. 00:50:54:14 - 00:50:58:00 Again, seeing like, the development of it and seeing how far we've come. 00:50:58:03 - 00:50:58:10 Yeah. 00:50:58:10 - 00:51:01:18 And just giving a shout out 00:51:01:18 - 00:51:06:06 to all the people that really paved the way for where, where we're at today. 00:51:06:08 - 00:51:06:14 Yeah. 00:51:06:14 - 00:51:08:21 Without those people, there would be no community 00:51:08:21 - 00:51:12:08 and there would be no nothing to sort of, pick up. 00:51:13:01 - 00:51:15:11 So it was it was an honor. 00:51:15:11 - 00:51:18:09 It was an honor to to work on that, that capsule. 00:51:18:09 - 00:51:22:06 I think that it's an interesting piece of history 00:51:22:06 - 00:51:27:19 because we have this safe, this vault, essentially, that's going to contain 00:51:27:19 - 00:51:32:09 all of these, like, artifacts that, will be unearthed. 00:51:32:09 - 00:51:36:16 One day and people will be able to see how far hip hop has come. 00:51:36:16 - 00:51:37:12 Right? Yeah. 00:51:37:12 - 00:51:42:08 And, I think if we do things like this, we kind of say to the world 00:51:42:08 - 00:51:46:01 that this is important, that this matters, and that we need to keep doing 00:51:46:01 - 00:51:46:21 stuff like this. 00:51:46:21 - 00:51:51:02 So, yeah, I was again, just very honored to, to be a part of that. 00:51:51:02 - 00:51:56:05 And I hope that, it serves some positive purpose in the future. 00:51:56:06 - 00:51:57:00 Yeah, yeah. 00:51:58:07 - 00:52:01:15 Any upcoming projects or collaborations that you're excited about? 00:52:01:15 - 00:52:04:15 Like, what's next for you? 00:52:05:22 - 00:52:07:07 Disrupt. 00:52:07:07 - 00:52:09:12 Yeah. It, I'm really stoked on disrupt. 00:52:09:12 - 00:52:10:06 Like, I'll be honest. 00:52:10:06 - 00:52:14:02 Like, I like some of the other artists that you guys work 00:52:14:02 - 00:52:17:19 with are constantly working on projects because it's their full time job. 00:52:18:02 - 00:52:21:13 My full time job as a secondary, like a secondary 00:52:21:13 - 00:52:24:13 teacher, and I have two kids at home. 00:52:24:15 - 00:52:27:11 So my time is just really eaten up by that. 00:52:27:11 - 00:52:29:19 And that's my main focus. 00:52:29:19 - 00:52:32:20 I do run an art club at the school, and we put together 00:52:32:20 - 00:52:35:04 student art displays and mural projects there, 00:52:35:04 - 00:52:37:11 so that's something that I'm really excited about. 00:52:37:11 - 00:52:40:04 I, I find a lot of joy in that 00:52:40:04 - 00:52:44:12 because the kids that show up for art club are there because they want to be there. 00:52:44:23 - 00:52:48:22 There's no restraints in terms of like assessments 00:52:48:22 - 00:52:51:17 or like no pressure because they're not getting marked on their work. 00:52:51:17 - 00:52:57:05 So it's really cool for me to offer like an, just a space for students 00:52:57:05 - 00:53:00:16 to go and just express themselves however they want to express themselves. 00:53:01:11 - 00:53:03:15 And, those are projects that I'm really excited about. 00:53:03:15 - 00:53:06:03 But disrupt is something that I always look forward to. 00:53:06:03 - 00:53:08:02 I mean, now that we've got the ball rolling on this 00:53:08:02 - 00:53:12:09 and it's happening every year, it's, an awesome opportunity. 00:53:12:09 - 00:53:14:18 I had such a blast last year. It was so fun. 00:53:14:18 - 00:53:16:17 It was a lot of really fun. 00:53:16:17 - 00:53:19:16 And, I look forward to just continuing this. 00:53:19:16 - 00:53:21:08 I mean, if the goal is to have one of these 00:53:21:08 - 00:53:22:04 every single year, 00:53:22:04 - 00:53:25:15 then that'll be like my big highlight in terms of art every year. 00:53:25:15 - 00:53:27:10 And it's something that's going to keep me going. 00:53:27:10 - 00:53:28:21 Yeah, amazing. 00:53:28:21 - 00:53:30:11 We definitely want it to be a yearly thing, 00:53:30:11 - 00:53:32:17 if not something that's even more so. 00:53:32:17 - 00:53:34:20 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:53:34:20 - 00:53:36:21 Me again. 00:53:37:20 - 00:53:39:03 So this is like our wrap up, I guess. 00:53:39:03 - 00:53:40:17 Yeah. So this has been really awesome. 00:53:40:17 - 00:53:42:17 Thanks for sharing your journey and insights with us. 00:53:42:17 - 00:53:45:17 Where can people find more of your work? 00:53:46:06 - 00:53:49:09 For starters, I guess, like we said, disrupt 2024. 00:53:49:12 - 00:53:51:04 I guess you could talk a bit about that. 00:53:51:04 - 00:53:54:13 You worked, you had two pieces, which was great. 00:53:54:13 - 00:53:56:18 The one during the festival itself. 00:53:56:18 - 00:54:01:01 And then you got to do the other piece so people, I can tell people where it is 00:54:01:01 - 00:54:05:08 if you want, but it's basically, right behind the National Gallery of Canada, 00:54:05:08 - 00:54:07:03 underneath the new footbridge there. 00:54:07:03 - 00:54:09:13 Right by Alexandra Bridge on Saint Patrick. 00:54:09:13 - 00:54:13:02 So if you just go down that little, roadway by Major Hills 00:54:13:02 - 00:54:16:02 Park there that takes you to the locks at the Chateau Laurier. 00:54:16:04 - 00:54:17:13 There's a big wall there. 00:54:17:13 - 00:54:20:17 Dexus piece is the second from the left, if you're looking at it. 00:54:20:17 - 00:54:22:12 And then the rooster on it. Yeah. 00:54:22:12 - 00:54:24:12 And it says it says pause. 00:54:24:12 - 00:54:27:15 And then, he also did the back side of the community wall. 00:54:27:15 - 00:54:30:15 So it says community and community maybe. 00:54:30:15 - 00:54:31:23 Is that right? Yeah. Yeah. 00:54:31:23 - 00:54:32:20 I actually Michelle. 00:54:32:20 - 00:54:34:05 Yeah. So French and English. 00:54:34:05 - 00:54:36:06 So you can definitely check it out there. 00:54:36:06 - 00:54:41:03 Is there any other pieces that like that you really want to talk about that 00:54:41:03 - 00:54:43:05 you have in the city that are still like there? 00:54:44:16 - 00:54:47:05 Well, I've got some work in the Byward market. 00:54:47:05 - 00:54:50:03 I think there's like a shipping container that I painted a piece on there. 00:54:50:03 - 00:54:53:01 And there's, murals here and there. 00:54:53:01 - 00:54:53:09 Yeah. 00:54:53:09 - 00:54:58:16 But, yeah, I don't have any social media presence. 00:54:58:16 - 00:55:01:10 I don't have a website. I really just do this for fun. 00:55:01:10 - 00:55:02:02 No. It's awesome. 00:55:02:02 - 00:55:04:12 And I think that, you know, a lot of, like, the projects 00:55:04:12 - 00:55:06:16 and things that I get involved in are all thanks to 00:55:06:16 - 00:55:09:23 you guys because you just kind of hit me up and say, do you want to do this? 00:55:09:23 - 00:55:11:12 And I'm like, yeah, cool. 00:55:11:12 - 00:55:14:16 So I'm not really big on on promoting myself. 00:55:14:16 - 00:55:19:23 In fact, like, I, I, I want to put the spotlight and attention 00:55:19:23 - 00:55:23:05 on the artists that you work with that are full time artists 00:55:23:05 - 00:55:27:04 and that rely on this as kind of like their, their bread and butter, 00:55:27:04 - 00:55:31:14 you know, so I, I, I'm thankful to be part of this, but yeah. 00:55:32:11 - 00:55:38:01 Other than, my home page or my artist bio page on your website, 00:55:38:01 - 00:55:39:23 I don't think there's anywhere else you can really find me. 00:55:39:23 - 00:55:42:22 But on that way too, like, I mean, the merch that we sell over is here. 00:55:42:22 - 00:55:44:10 Like, it's really well received. 00:55:44:10 - 00:55:45:07 People love it, right? 00:55:45:07 - 00:55:48:00 It's I mean, you can definitely come here and you can get upcycled 00:55:48:00 - 00:55:51:07 art cans with Dex's work on it and a whole bunch of different brands. 00:55:51:08 - 00:55:54:04 And but you know, it's people love it. 00:55:54:04 - 00:55:57:05 So it's great to be able to have your work live on in different ways too. 00:55:57:05 - 00:56:01:00 And like just wait till the the next one that you just did to come out. 00:56:01:00 - 00:56:03:16 So that will be really cool. But yeah, I know it's great. 00:56:03:16 - 00:56:06:08 And I think it's cool that everybody can have different focuses. 00:56:06:08 - 00:56:09:08 You could be like, hey, I want to do this full time or I don't. 00:56:09:15 - 00:56:10:18 I decided early on 00:56:10:18 - 00:56:13:23 when I was a young artist, that I didn't want to do art as a career, 00:56:13:23 - 00:56:15:17 so I became a photographer because I was like, 00:56:15:17 - 00:56:19:01 I could do this every day, and I can, you know, perfect that craft. 00:56:19:01 - 00:56:21:00 But I didn't want to have the pressure as an artist. 00:56:21:00 - 00:56:23:21 So I think it's cool that you can you can do either. Right? 00:56:23:21 - 00:56:24:21 And you don't have to. 00:56:24:21 - 00:56:26:18 I know a lot of people come in here and they're like, 00:56:26:18 - 00:56:28:09 they ask us, they're like, where's your work? 00:56:28:09 - 00:56:29:17 And we're like, we don't have our work here 00:56:29:17 - 00:56:32:07 because we don't really care to to represent ourselves. 00:56:32:07 - 00:56:34:05 We want to change the landscape of our city 00:56:34:05 - 00:56:35:15 and support the artists in the city. 00:56:35:15 - 00:56:37:09 And that's our our main goal. 00:56:37:09 - 00:56:40:20 I could care less if I ever showcased anything ever again. 00:56:41:03 - 00:56:44:03 So it's just it's kind of fun to look at things differently and be like, 00:56:44:03 - 00:56:47:03 you know, there's a purpose for all of us and we can all be part of this whole 00:56:47:08 - 00:56:48:15 making the art scene better. 00:56:48:15 - 00:56:51:19 But we don't have to be the ones that are doing all the pieces 00:56:51:19 - 00:56:54:19 or do it as a career, and it's great to support those ones in different ways. 00:56:54:19 - 00:56:58:23 So for sure, yeah, yeah, like I think that, it's important 00:56:58:23 - 00:57:03:01 to pursue whatever dreams you have and, 00:57:03:01 - 00:57:06:02 and find inspiration wherever you can. 00:57:06:02 - 00:57:09:11 But, for me, I just, I literally just do this for fun. 00:57:09:11 - 00:57:09:20 Yeah. 00:57:09:20 - 00:57:12:19 And whenever I can find time between, 00:57:12:19 - 00:57:16:19 you know, being a dad and a teacher to squeeze some art in, then I'll do it. 00:57:16:19 - 00:57:22:13 And, I never really had an ambition of becoming like, professional artist. 00:57:22:14 - 00:57:25:06 It's just always something that I really enjoyed doing. 00:57:25:06 - 00:57:28:17 And, I just hope that that passion never goes away. 00:57:28:18 - 00:57:31:07 Yeah. It's great for your whole, like, well-being, right. 00:57:31:07 - 00:57:31:22 Yeah. 00:57:31:22 - 00:57:33:01 Yeah, yeah. 00:57:33:01 - 00:57:35:07 So, Dex, before we wrap up, do you have anything else that. 00:57:36:08 - 00:57:39:08 No, I just want to say thank you very much for for everything 00:57:39:08 - 00:57:43:14 that we did here today and everything that you guys are doing in general, 00:57:43:14 - 00:57:46:23 I think that, other organizations 00:57:46:23 - 00:57:50:01 in the city should be paying attention to what you guys are doing. 00:57:50:09 - 00:57:53:15 I'm in awe of, like, the dedication that you guys have put into this. 00:57:53:15 - 00:57:58:00 You're both very hard working individuals and just, you know, to 00:57:58:00 - 00:58:03:18 to be invited to be even a small part of, of your journey is, is an honor. 00:58:03:18 - 00:58:05:10 So thank you. Yeah. 00:58:05:10 - 00:58:06:19 Thank you for everything. 00:58:06:19 - 00:58:07:10 So let's do. 00:58:07:10 - 00:58:10:10 This episode was brought to life by the crew at the urban Art collective, 00:58:10:10 - 00:58:14:11 edited by Visual Jesus with original tunes from The Boosh, 00:58:15:07 - 00:58:18:02 Big Love to Awesome Ottawa for making this podcast happen. 00:58:18:02 - 00:58:21:02 Their support helps us keep digging into Ottawa's creative scene. 00:58:21:16 - 00:58:25:07 Extra thanks to the City of Ottawa Street six program and the Center Tampa's 00:58:25:08 - 00:58:26:18 Uncommon Spaces. 00:58:26:18 - 00:58:30:15 Through their partnership with our Disrupt Urban Art activations, we get to keep 00:58:30:15 - 00:58:33:15 sharing the voices and stories that make the city so damn cool. 00:58:33:23 - 00:58:35:07 If you're local, come say hi. 00:58:35:07 - 00:58:38:07 We're at 1088 Somerset Street West in Hinton Burg, 00:58:38:10 - 00:58:41:10 or check us out online anytime at urban Art collective. 00:58:41:17 - 00:58:42:02 Are you 00:58:43:02 - 00:58:45:02 looking for a creative studio space? 00:58:45:02 - 00:58:46:23 We got rentals right next door to the gallery, 00:58:46:23 - 00:58:49:22 plus a full print line for all your print needs. 00:58:49:22 - 00:58:52:16 Head up our site to learn more 00:58:52:16 - 00:58:55:17 and don't forget to follow us on Instagram, Facebook or YouTube. 00:58:55:17 - 00:58:59:20 The urban Art collective AKA for all the latest drops, shows and events. 00:59:00:11 - 00:59:03:11 Lastly, a huge thank you for listening and supporting what we do 00:59:03:16 - 00:59:05:12 every time you tune in, share the pod, 00:59:05:12 - 00:59:08:12 or show up at one of our events, you're helping keep this movement alive. 00:59:08:22 - 00:59:09:18 Subscribe. 00:59:09:18 - 00:59:12:07 Swing by a show or come just hang out. 00:59:12:07 - 00:59:14:22 We seriously couldn't do it without you. Thanks.